Ask Loston (Dr. Stupid Jr)...

[Bruce Lee]

I have it to and I love it. I forgot to ask you, isn't "Dark Passage" the movie with Humphrey Bogart and Lauren Bacall where he's an innocent man wrongly imprisoned who escapes and she finds him, helps him and falls in love with him? If that's the one, I love that movie! I won't spoil it for anyone but I really recommend it just for some darn good entertainment. It also stars one of my favorite radio actresses, Agnes Moorehead who became famous and Endora on the show "Bewitched".

DARK PASSAGE is a great film. Today they wouldn't make a movie where the lead actor spends the first half of the film wearing bandages over his face. Too much vanity for that. You can't even get them to keep their masks on in superhero films for more than 2 minutes at a clip.

Long before she was Endora on BEWITCHED, Agnes Moorehead played Margo Lane, starring with Orson Welles on air in the famous THE SHADOW radio show.

[Jcatlett76]

DARK PASSAGE is a great film. Today they wouldn't make a movie where the lead actor spends the first half of the film wearing bandages over his face. Too much vanity for that. You can't even get them to keep their masks on in superhero films for more than 2 minutes at a clip.

Long before she was Endora on BEWITCHED, Agnes Moorehead played Margo Lane, starring with Orson Welles on air in the famous THE SHADOW radio show.

I just spotted some typos in my posts lol. I meant to say she later because famous as Endora. By that I mean, other than radio and film, she was a character actress who played a lot of bit parts in a lot of different TV shows. "Bewitched" was the first television show where she played a major supporting character. I guess I should have said that she regained her fame. The TV audience was a generation apart from the radio audience that knew her so well. I think she was absolutely wonderful in everything she did. Yep, she was Margo Lane! The lady was an absolute beauty and a great talent. I find it hard to believe that there's somebody else within a hundred miles of me that knows this stuff

If you haven't already, there's a movie that Agnes Moorehead is in that you may like to check out. It's called "The Big Street". (1942). She has a small part in it but it really shows how attractive of a woman she was in her youth. The movie actually stars Lucille Ball and Henry Fonda. It was co-written by Damon Runyon who had the radio show, "Damon Runyon Theater".

Also, she was terrific in the episodes of "Suspense" she starred in.
Example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdIyOz8o82M

And, if it's not too irritating to watch in ten minute increments, someone has posted "The Big Street" on youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uToq...feature=relmfu

Ok, I didn't intend to take up anymore space on your thread Loston...but I just love this stuff. Maybe I'll start a thread about OTR and old movies in the Break Room...I doubt many people here even listen to Old Time Radio shows though.

By the way, I'm about 30 minutes into "Earth Vs The Flying Saucers" which I found on youtube, watching through my TV. It's pretty good so far. It's been paused since last night (got sleepy). I'll finish it today sometime.

Edit:
I finished watching "Earth Vs The Flying Saucers". I really enjoyed it. I love any 1950s SciFi but had always stayed away from that one for some reason...wish I'd watched it much sooner. Think I'll watch "Destination Moon" again.

[Lonrott]

Thanks for the question, Lonrott!

Personally, I never use those jagged panel lines. I find them to be unnecessary and ultimately too distracting. I don't feel like I need to resort to such gimmicks to pull off exciting panels, and I think the look of those jagged panels make a page look dated. The 1990s are over. Time to move forward. I choose to rely on my compositions, line energy and figure drawing skills instead. I let my drawing ability speak for itself. That's just how I roll.

I would warn artists not to get too hung up on gimmicks and tricks. They can be very effective, but a lot of artists tend to over-use visual gimmicks. When they're over-used, the can become mundane, and they can cease to have impact. You also run the risk of creating confusing page layouts if you use too many gimmicks on a page. CLARITY has to be job number one. If you don't have that, you've failed as a sequential artist. A comic page that readers can't make heads or tails is rather worthless.

You have to know when and when not to use gimmicks on a comic page. When the story calls for something important or requiring impact, that's the time to consider them. If you're just drawing your hero jumping around in the city, you don't really need to pull out all the stops. A nice, sizable panel with a dynamic drawing of the character in action should suffice. You don't necessarily need to give the panel jagged borders, or an extreme POV shot, or to break the panel borders with the figure, or give the panel an extreme panel tilt. Restraint is often the better way to go. You should strive for exciting layouts, but manic, cluttered, busy panels and distracting page designs doesn't do your storytelling any favors.

A great way to design a page is to pick one panel out and make it your anchor panel (key panel) on the page. Generally, you want it to be the panel that's the most important. Make it the best panel on the page. It can be bigger than the other panels, but it doesn't have to be unrealistically large panel. You don't have to make it a half splash--just make it GOOD. Good drawing. You can choose to use a POV angle shot or use some other trick if you'd like, but make sure that it's a panel the reader will enjoy and remember. Make it a panel that adds impact to your story, or that enriches the visual storytelling. Make it the best panel on the page.

Hey, thanks for getting back to me. Great response and I will keep it in mind.

[Bruce Lee]

Hey, thanks for getting back to me. Great response and I will keep it in mind.

You're welcome.

Next!

[Jcatlett76]

I have what may be a stupid question. I'm interested in doing a super-hero daily comic strip for the web and I want to do it in a style similar to Jack Kirby. Well, at least as far as the figures are concerned. I've studied his work for years and lately been going over it for hours at the time and I can not make out any rhyme or reason for how he drew his figures from the sixties onward. Not the basic form but the musculature. I know that there is no anatomical correctness in his jagged lines but man...his stuff looks so good! I can't even become close to figuring out how or where to do the whole straight/jagged line thing. He made the whole thing look so effortless. I'm sure there's a name for that technique somewhere but I don't know it. Anyway, any insight on this or do you know of any resources that may be available to learn just what in the heck Kirby was doing in his basement?

[Bruce Lee]

I have what may be a stupid question. I'm interested in doing a super-hero daily comic strip for the web and I want to do it in a style similar to Jack Kirby. Well, at least as far as the figures are concerned. I've studied his work for years and lately been going over it for hours at the time and I can not make out any rhyme or reason for how he drew his figures from the sixties onward. Not the basic form but the musculature. I know that there is no anatomical correctness in his jagged lines but man...his stuff looks so good! I can't even become close to figuring out how or where to do the whole straight/jagged line thing. He made the whole thing look so effortless. I'm sure there's a name for that technique somewhere but I don't know it. Anyway, any insight on this or do you know of any resources that may be available to learn just what in the heck Kirby was doing in his basement?

Sounds like you're talking about the lines that have come to be known as the "Kirby Squiggles." Those crazy "Kirby Squiggle" lines and other bold lines in the arms and legs of Jack Kirby's figures are stylized representations of muscle and sinew. While they might not always seem to be anatomically correct, they do follow the logic of it. They are not merely window dressing or decorations on the figure. Occasionally Kirby used those squiggle lines to indicate shiny textures, like reflections on metal, but most of the time they represent the stretch of muscles and tendons. On characters on the Silver Surfer, they represent both:




A little backstory to explain a few things...

Jack Kirby began working in comics at a time when original artwork for comics was drawn on much larger paper. Today, we draw comic pages half-up from the size of the printed page, or 50% larger than it will appear in the printed page. That comes out roughly to an image area of 10"X15", but that's not an exact measurement. Page dimensions actually differ slightly from company to company, and the width of pages tends to be less than 10" wide these days. When Jack Kirby began drawing comic pages, they were drawn twice-up (about 13.5"X 21"). That's a much bigger board to work on. By the mid 1960s art was being produced at 12.5" X 20.5", but that's still far larger than most comic artists work today. Jack Kirby actually didn't draw with a normal pencil. He used one of those flat, carpenter pencils:
http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk/...ers-pencil.jpg

These pencils could produce a thin line or a wide line, depending on how you turned them, so Kirby liked them for this reason. The extra wide, flat "point" of the pencil was also good for filling in shadows on a page, producing thicker lines, etc. I'm speculating a bit here, but I think that Kirby's use of the carpenter pencil, drawing on larger board, and meeting tight deadlines did a lot to alter his approach to drawing in general. When artists have to work fast, you have to find ways to leave out certain details, and ways to keep other details in. This compromise often produces a more stylized approach to things. It seems very likely that the "Kirby squiggles" derived from Kirby's use of a carpenter pencil to produce line work at a fast clip. Turning the pencil as you draw will produce thick to thin lines. Kirby liked the contrast of thin lines and bold lines on a figure, and the contrast is quite interesting. His figures were often very blocky, but this blockiness, along with his stylized spotted black shapes, gave his figures solidity and weight that other artists' figures in comics didn't have.

Kirby balanced the bulk of his figures with more graceful, curving lines in the limbs. Unlike many pencillers of the Gold and Silver Age, Jack Kirby produced finished pencils most of the time. They were complete--with line weights, shadows and background details. Jack Kirby was known for his speed as a penciller. He could produce 5 pages of finished pencils a day! When you consider that he was working on the much larger board, which took longer to fill, that's quite remarkable. It's how Jack Kirby made a living at comics. He worked twice as fast. Knowing that, it seems logical that Kirby's style developed--in part --out of necessity. His speed garnered him more work. He is one of the few artists that could boast that he was drawing 4 or more books in a single month! When you're that busy, you have to find a ways to get the job done efficiently, and done as quickly as possible. So I submit to you that Kirby's style was forged between the hammer of deadlines and the iron of his work ethic. The result was an artistic shorthand method of drawing that produced three-dimensional figures of unparalleled action and excitement. His people weren't always pretty, but they were always visually interesting, and his artwork was always engaging. Generations of comic artists have borrowed his dynamic layouts, foreshortenings and figure techniques.

[Ian Miller]

Man, Loston, now I have a whole new outlook on Kirby's work. I knew that he developed his style for the purposes of efficiency and speed, but I had no idea he used a carpenter's pencil! To me it always looked like he used a dull, soft lead in his work, but I just assumed it was an unsharpened drafting pencil, maybe with a 2B or softer lead. There were thin lines, sure, but most of them tended to be very thick. I might have to try a carpenter pencil out, it seems like it would be an interesting exercise.

[Jcatlett76]

Thanks, Loston. I had no idea that he worked with a carpenters pencil. I actually have a few of them laying around. I don't like using them though because they are a pain to sharpen & I just don't like holding them. And...WOW, I've searched everywhere online for more information on Kirby's process and couldn't find a thing. You've really helped me out here. You know, as a kid, I hated Kirby's stuff for the reason you mentioned. It wasn't pretty. But as an adult I began to appreciate it a lot! It's so dynamic and there's something in almost every panel that jumps out. Sure there are tons of better "artists" out there but that man is a master story teller. I just can't believe he didn't lay anything out. He started with the finished product and that's just not heard of!

Thanks again!

[Bruce Lee]

Thanks, Loston. I had no idea that he worked with a carpenters pencil. I actually have a few of them laying around. I don't like using them though because they are a pain to sharpen & I just don't like holding them. And...WOW, I've searched everywhere online for more information on Kirby's process and couldn't find a thing. You've really helped me out here. You know, as a kid, I hated Kirby's stuff for the reason you mentioned. It wasn't pretty. But as an adult I began to appreciate it a lot! It's so dynamic and there's something in almost every panel that jumps out. Sure there are tons of better "artists" out there but that man is a master story teller. I just can't believe he didn't lay anything out. He started with the finished product and that's just not heard of!

Thanks again!

Glad I could answer your question, and shine some light on things.

Next!

[Carl_Shinyama]

A question on your own process: Do you draw backgrounds or figures first.