Storytelling 101

trasnauj · 04-12-2006, 10:05 PM

One of the best threads I've seen on PJ in a long time. Thanks for sharing!

**EddieChingLives** · 04-22-2006, 07:56 PM

Thanks for commenting. I'm glad this seems to be helpful.

Maybe I'll makie a mini-comic manual out of this stuff and sell it for a buck someday. If I ever get around to it.

For an update, I just figured out that my 102 pen nib can create thick to thin lines by loading it up with ink, and pressing down on the paper, spreading apart the points, and releasing the pressure. Why didn't I know this before? Pretty sad. Basic knowledge any regular inker would know. But some people, like me, didn't know this.

Thanks for bumping the thread. It's allways a pain in the butt to check my amazingly high view count, so this makes it easier to me revel in my popularity.

And by the way, if I haven't mentioned it before, please check out Kazu Kibuishi's awesome tutorial! Definately inspiring and will make you want to draw!

http://www.boltcity.com/workshop/copper_tutorial/
and he's a member of pj:
http://www.penciljack.com/forum/showthread.php?t=64945

UPDATE: You have to read Dave Sim's articles on self publishing. There are tons of great advice:
http://www.amptoons.com/howto/sim/168.html
It doesn't stop at 168 either. Very inspiring. Such as drawing in the 6x9 aspect ratio, and the importance of good layouts and lettering. And great quotes such as:
" The cliche (which isn't a cliche, it's the truth) is that you have two thousand bad pages in you and until you draw them, you won't start producing good pages."
Issue 174 is my personal favorite.

**EddieChingLives** · 08-21-2006, 01:49 PM

In case you didn't know, I downloaded a freeware program called autoscreenrecorder. Google it! So here are some cool, yet crappy, youtube sketches I did!

Drawing a Dude in a Room in One Point Perspective
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMZkCpU0d8c

Drawing a Chick
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k55DBJ_n-is&NR

Drawing a Dude
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjiYEo2QoJs

UPDATE!!!
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It is really a lesson to be learned by comparing a comic book script to the final work! It all started with that Wizard thing that Scott McDaniel did a while ago.

However, I bought Sandman III which has Neil Gaiman's script in the back of the first issue of that trade. It was only 15 bucks. Worth it, to see how he personalzes the script, seeing him write stuff like "THE STREET SHOULD BE DIRTY, NEWSPAPER BLOWING DOWN IT". This kind of writing frustrates me as an artist, but it's good to see that Kelly Jones just did it his way. He didn't get caught up in a technicallity that the writer had in mind. I'm allways curious if writers write all this stuff just for ammo, to give the artist ideas to go on, or if they want all that detail in there.

For me, as a writer of 2 fanfict TMNT stories, I just wanted to give the artist the idea of what I had in mind, but I liked seeing the pages, and how different their point of view took them.

ALSO, if you are a fan of Duane McDuffie, the writer of Deathlock and other famous titles, definately check out this page!
http://homepage.mac.com/dmcduffie/site/Scripts.html
He's got his scripts organized by loose plot, and tight script. It's sooooo cool reading Deathlock no.2 and seeing how close it was to the script, and wonder WHY Denys Cowan changed parts of it.

**EddieChingLives** · 10-15-2006, 08:12 AM

Ok. I haven't read anything about how to draw/write a fight scene. But that doesn't mean there isn't any information out there.

Now, if you got a crap-load of characters fighting, like that Infinity Gauntlet dude, I'll have to get back to you on that one.

But let's just look at two characters fighting. How does a fight start off?

THE SETUP

Chinese standoff style (as in BigTroubleInLittleChina). No one says a word. It adds to the dramatic showdown.

Maybe the character's use just hand gestures to start off the fight, like in Adam Warren's Gen13Bootleg.

Hell, maybe they just yell at each other Springer Style. Something to setup the conflict and add tension and suspense. Make the reader's can't wait for things to get out of control.

EXCHANGE BLOWS

I've noticed in fight scenes, especially in SavageDragon, there will be one panel of a hero getting clocked, followed by a panel of the villain getting clocked.

That's the thing about comics, you have to simplify the action. That's why there's allways a discussion about sometihing else while they fight. There's no way if you're swinging a punch at a person, that you'll keep talking a whole paragraph before you land the punch, but some reason, it works in comics.

And while exchanging blows, it doesn't have to be dead even. In fact, it's kind of cool to see the hero get the complete crap knocked out of him, then he can come back and dig down deep to win the fight. Or he can get his ass kicked and the villain can leave.

YOU CAN ADD THESE INTO THE MIX

The Struggle
Sometimes at the beginning of a fight, there's a panel with the hero and villain struggling, either by blocking and holding each other's wrists, both attempt blows that miss, or sometimes these panels come at the end, like when Doomsday and Superman exchange their final blows in one panel. Some fights don't have these panels, they just exchange blows until someone walks away. It's just another weopan in your artistic arsenal.

The Recovery
Sometimes a hero gets knocked through a window, it might seem to be a bit of a jump cut if the next panel is another exchange of a blow, so it might be nice to have a panel showing the character getting back up holding his head or arm or something. But that's up to the storyteller.

Down For The Count
This panel usually someone is knocked down and they aren't getting back up. Usually, the winner's legs are in the panel, and we see the other guy laying on the ground. Sometimes the winner is walking away in the panel.

But this could go under a different section of the fight scene:

WHAT HAPPENS TO THE LOSER?
Do they escape? Run away? Retreat?

Maybe they get arrested.

Maybe they are killed.

Maybe they both come to a mutual understanding and shake hands and make up.

Maybe a sword or gun is pointed at one of their heads, and that's the end.

But the main epic ending that usually happens in the majority of film and comic epics.

A building explodes!

I hope this helps.

uPDATE:
Here's a crappy examples. Spent 5min. on this to give u an idea. But study ACTUAL comics! They are put together a lot better than this.

http://aftershock.250free.com/fight.jpg

UPDATE: Did you guys see where I messed up on this panel. Okay, I know the list of anatomy problems is infinite...besides that. The last panel, I should have reversed the way the guy is laying. If he was hit in the previous panel, I broke the 180 degree rule in the last panel!

UpdatedUPDATE!
http://www.willterrell.com/creatingc...erspective.htm
Will Terrell has an awesome perspective tutorial! cHECK IT OUT!

**EddieChingLives** · 12-02-2006, 10:19 PM

So I've been thinking about writing some more, so here's a couple of things I've noticed.

KICK YOUR MAIN CHARACTERS ASS!

I don't know about you, but I don't think Rocky would have been as good a movie if he just easily kicked Apollo Creed's ass up and down the film. Viewers want to see a struggle! Make it seem impossible for your hero to win.

There's nothing more annoying than a hero winning effortless. No struggle. BORING!

Want more examples of this?

I liked Hulk Hogan matches because just when you think he's got no energy left, he then becomes INVINCIBLE!

Terminator 2, the T101 friggin' dies! Luckily, power is re-routed, and he puts the T1000's eye out!

Robocop is about to be stabbed, as he's stuck in a pile of rubble, yet he uses his data claw at the last second!

Also, GIVE YOUR CHARACTER A TOUGH CHOICE.

Nothing is better than seeing Spiderman choose between saving Aunt May or Mary Jane! And then he figures out how to do both!

I started thinking about this when I thought of a short story about a burglar breaking in and witnessing a potential serial killer try to kill a woman! Does he risk getting caught and not getting the jewels and possible death or arrest, or does he let an innocent woman die?

Try to put your characters between a rock and a hard place, and try to challenge them, so they have to weigh the pros and cons. Think about honor, the right thing to do vs. the easier thing to do!

Don't go easy on your characters. Give em hell! The readers will apreciate it more, and maybe they'll stick around till the end to watch your hero pull it off!

Hope this helps someone! Just some random thoughts for food.
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UPDATE: Did some YOUTUBE VIDEOS, but I don't want to bump my thread up, since they are currently on the main page, and I don't want to be redundant:

The main point of these videos is to try to get you guys off your lazy asses and crank out some comics!

You can't get any better by just looking at good comics and reading all the books in the world. If you are waiting to be a perfect artist, you'll wait forever.

Talent schmalent, just do it allready! It's the only key to getting better!!!

Part 1: Getting Started
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nY_MiJnvOyY
1:14

Part 2: Tightening up!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3b9L_oKh-0
8:01

Part 3: Lettering and Inks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdbj78LPy20
9:55

Part 4: Blacking out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxd2--3yT70
5:30

Part 5: Cleanup and Toning
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeehkwC7tGw
5:38

Part 6: Panel Pieces
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bCTUEGmLass
3:13

Part 7: Breaking Down A Story
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeyd-BkYeIQ
7:32