PTR1: SilverSkies vs Captain All That

[SilverSkies]

Topic: WILDCATS vs X-MEN (Any characters from topic)

SilverSkies
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/4395/pj11.jpg

Captain All That
http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc340/Captainallthat/wildcatsvsxmen.jpg

[SilverSkies]

cool work Captain!!!!!!!!!

[adultbraces]

Both are exceptionally laid out & designed well. Seriously, both show great and interesting ways to show there fight scene and they don't fall into the "seen it before" category. Well done!

[SilverSkies]

Both are exceptionally laid out & designed well. Seriously, both show great and interesting ways to show there fight scene and they don't fall into the "seen it before" category. Well done!

Thnaks man!

[ThrashArt]

nice work. went with silverskies. Although at firstglance i thought it was Captain America.

[Beastie]

I dunno. Hmmm. Silverskies piece looks like a heavily referenced piece to me. A Jim Lee X-men character pasted together with a Jim Lee Wildcats character.

[Telekinetic Ketchup]

had to give it to Silver because to me his is the only one that looks like a fight.

[Popninja]

I dunno. Hmmm. Silverskies piece looks like a heavily referenced piece to me. A Jim Lee X-men character pasted together with a Jim Lee Wildcats character.

I agree. I definitely recognize that Maul.

[Beastie]

I agree. I definitely recognize that Maul.

I'm glad that someone picked up on what I said and agreed with me.

Its very frustrating though. I have been scanning the internet for these pics - and can't find them -- but I'm pretty sure they're copied.

I've definitely seen them before.

Its unfair on Captain All That.

Silverskies, what's your response to this? Copying is not something I associate with you -- but this doesn't feel like its purely your own work. :(

[spidey976]

I'm glad that someone picked up on what I said and agreed with me.

Its very frustrating though. I have been scanning the internet for these pics - and can't find them -- but I'm pretty sure they're copied.

I've definitely seen them before.

Its unfair on Captain All That.

Silverskies, what's your response to this? Copying is not something I associate with you -- but this doesn't feel like its purely your own work. :(

WildC.A.T.S miniseries ... issue 3 ... when Maul grows to big for his brain and is thrashing YoungBlood ... it is a tiny panel. I caught it to ... but needed to double check it. I am not sure if it is a referenced copy ... or something a little worse.

EDIT: Okay it was ALOT worse

[dfbovey]

Looked familiar to me as well, if someone has visual reference of it though... I'd appreciate it. We can't have this kind of thing in this tournament. And I'll need visual evidence if I'm going to disqualify someone.

Or, Silverskies... if you did what's suspected. You might as well do the honorable thing and come clean.

[Bruce Lee]

I have proof that Silverskies isn't playing fair. I have all of Jim Lee's WILDC.A.T.S. issues and Spidey976 is absolutely right about Maul. You're not on the level, holmes! Silverskies is directly swiping/tracing/stealing his art from Jim Lee. It's a fact :(

I'm not sure what the rules are for the P.U.M.M.E.L event, but I'm pretty sure it's unfair to Captain All That that Silverskies is tagging in Jim Lee when the referee's back is turned. This is a bad show all around, Silver, and Captain All That deserves better from you. He put forth his best legit effort. Why aren't you doing the same? In fact, everyone in this tournament is working hard to win on their own merits, but you're not only stealing from Jim Lee here, you're also disrespecting your fellow Penciljackers. Worst of all, you're disrespecting yourself, because you have so little faith in your own work and abilities that you're stooping to do anything you can to win, your own dignity and self-respect be damned! Yep... a bad show all around. It's very, very disappointing to see someone undermine draw-offs like this with no regard for other's feelings or for the consequences of their actions. All that you could have possibly gained from such an undeserving victory is...well, what...? Bragging rights??!! It hardly seems worth ruining your reputation over, and certainly not worth screwing someone else over.

You owe apologies to a lot of people. It'd be some consolation for you to confess to your actions and publicly apologize to both Captain All That and to dfbovey. It's the absolutely LEAST you should do. Dfbovey has worked hard to give PJers a little something extra to look forward to with the P.U.M.M.E.L. event, and you've pissed all over everything he's trying to do. His hard work, extra time and efforts spent trying to make this site a better place for everyone deserves respect, not this crap. He and Captain All That both deserve better from you.

This image below shows the shameful truth about your work. Quite disappointing:

Proof:

http://www.lostonwallace.com/silverskies.jpg



Loston

[Beastie]

100% truth from Loston.

I don't think anyone could disagree with a single word thats been said.

[Cuddly]

Swipe city.

Seriously, did you think no one would notice? On *THIS* forum?

[Spidey]

I don't want to sound like I'm joining the mob, but I thought the same thing. I even PMed him asking him if it was referenced. He said no and that he attributed the art to the fact that he had just recently purchased an anatomy book. I scoured the net tirelessly for Maul pics too and even Hulk pics. It may be some obscure interior drawing. It seems any time SilverSkies and tournaments mix shenanigans ensue. I wouldn't be surprised if he did the same for the Mr Freeze drawing. You can tell when finished inks are traced.

edit:THANK YOU LOSTON! Can you do the same for the Mr Freeze and Nico? lol

[Spidey]

Quote:Originally Posted by Spidey
Did you use reference for the Maul/Collosus picture?

Quote:Originally Posted by SilverSkies
yeah. I used Anatomy references and Last Week I brought Anatomy Book!!!!Why anything wrong?

[Bathill8]

That's a quick one week turnaround! Tutorial please. Anyhow...good job, if you did it correctly....and Captain all that...nice flow and pencils man!

[Telekinetic Ketchup]

Man that's depressing Silver, I always thought better of you.


Looow blow man.

[dfbovey]

Well, there's nothing I can say that hasn't already been said. Sorry to say, Silver, but you've been disqualified. The poll has been closed and altered. The result is final.

Loston, thank you very much for your words on this and the visual proof.

[kman]

Not to jump on the bandwagon, but the colossus pose reminds me a lot of a pose out of Invincible. Don't have the books in front of me so I can't double check, but that pose looks pretty familiar.

[spidey976]

Damn ... Loston you beat me to it ... and GREAT job. Loston has said it all ... I think it would better if we had been able to PUSH Captain All That to a KO though.

As for Silver ... dude ... honestly you were that desperate to win a DO??? Totally useless .. and a waste of Captain All That's time ... though he did produce good work on this.

As for the DQ ... I totally agree ... and would like to also say ... I don't think Silver should be in any DrawOffs ... for at least a year ... and out of PUMMEL entirely. I would say the same thing if it were any ordinary DrawOff ... but to cheat during one of the MOST exciting things I have seen since I joined ... and an event that has started to produce some GREAT work ... I think it calls for a big response.

[makoi]

I thought the same when I saw the image. I believe the Colussus image is in the pages of the first ever Uncanny Xmen comic Jim Lee drew (#248 (http://www.bonanzle.com/booths/MusicMovieUniverse/items/Uncanny_X_Men__248__Sept_1989__1st_Jim_Lee__EASILY _CGC_9_4_)). I'm at work and can't check my back issue, but that's a pretty good guess.

[Breck]

I knew someone would find the drawing he swiped. I was scouring google images for Jim Lee drawings last night but I couldn't find it.

Swiping is bad enough, but swiping someone like Jim Lee and posting it to this forum is about the dumbest thing you can do.

[Breck]

I thought the same when I saw the image. I believe the Colussus image is in the pages of the first ever Uncanny Xmen comic Jim Lee drew (#248 (http://www.bonanzle.com/booths/MusicMovieUniverse/items/Uncanny_X_Men__248__Sept_1989__1st_Jim_Lee__EASILY _CGC_9_4_)). I'm at work and can't check my back issue, but that's a pretty good guess.
You're right. Good call.

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7640/theuncannyxmen248page7.jpg

[Beastie]

DOUBLE BUSTED!

[makoi]

I knew someone would find the drawing he swiped. I was scouring google images for Jim Lee drawings last night but I couldn't find it.

Swiping is bad enough, but swiping someone like Jim Lee and posting it to this forum is about the dumbest thing you can do.

Yup. Jim's gotta be the most immitated artist the past 20 years. Bad move on Silver's part.

[ThrashArt]

DOUBLE BUSTED!

LMAO. Not to make light of the situation but that was funny.

[Captain All That]

Thanks for speaking up guys. I knew the drawings wasn't his normal style but figured he just stepped his game up. I'm battling the flu right now and I think mine could have turned out a lot better. Anyways, thanks guys!

[Anubis2kx]

Wow man....That is straight ridiculous. I mean seriously though...people notice on here if you reference a pose too closely without mentioning it...but straight up swiping another's artwork...Jim Lee no less...and claiming it as your own against someone who came up with their own poses and composition?? Grimey in the worst way. Like Loston said, Bovey put alot of work into this and making sure that this is one of the most exciting thing to happen here, and you cheapened it.

Just because you're in the lightweight category, doesn't mean you have to go to cheating tactics to prove yourself here...just step your game up. I've seen some great original artwork from other lightweights in just this tournament so far from Hangman, Thrashart, Finfito, JC, Captain, and a host of others here. I'd like to think that they as well as myself have shown that we can do great stuff too...but you just set us back man.

Honestly, I think a DQ is too good for you. And not to bring clouds over your past stuff...but its like steroids, you getting busted now brings into question all of your past work.

[spidey976]

Honestly, I think a DQ is too good for you. And not to bring clouds over your past stuff...but its like steroids, you getting busted now brings into question all of your past work.

I say BRING THE RAIN ... forget the clouds. Looking at the piece he did against Scott for the their Street Fight I see two different styles ... the Batman ... and what NOW looks like a REALLY referenced Mr. Freeze. I also went back and looked at some of his old DO pieces ... and there are MASSIVE swings in style and ability. IMHO I think Scott's loss in the Street Fight should be turned to a win. I think Silver has been snowing us. Sad really.



Thanks for speaking up guys. I knew the drawings wasn't his normal style but figured he just stepped his game up. I'm battling the flu right now and I think mine could have turned out a lot better. Anyways, thanks guys!

You know ... it is cool to believe in people ... but this was obvious to any fans of the WildC.A.T.S. from the 90's ... heck I PMed Dave like 20 minutes after the poll went up. I have to say though ... Captain ... thanks for putting through a TRUE effort on this ... sick or not ... you did good dude.

[SilverSkies]

First I apologized!!!!!!!!!!!To ever one!!!!!

I agree with you guys, yes I referenced Jim lee work......Before that I wanna talk. See when I start drawing for the tournament. I think I wanna draw Maul vs. Colossus and I start sketching a lot, not this one and I tried lot but am not happy. I have an idea in my mind. It’s an action scene, so on that time I need a reference for Anatomy and I searched in net but didn’t get anything on that day (May 2). After that I brought an Anatomy Books (May 3). Again I start sketching but this time I think something missing in my art, so again I start searching on net for reference. But this I found a reference of pic, it was done by Jim lee and one more thing what think in my mind of action of maul and colossus for sketch, it’s same but little different. Same action of maul and colossus what I was think ed and I asked my friends. (Hey dude same action scene I was think Ed, and my friends said. Hey just draw it, it was like reference dude) (may3). On that time I think myself it was not like stealing….. I just think like Archerion did his pic link 1 (http://th08.deviantart.com/fs43/300W/f/2009/057/e/5/Hattori_Hanzo__s_Grandchild_by_WASIOLKA.jpg) and link 2 (http://th05.deviantart.com/fs41/300W/i/2009/032/3/a/Warrior_by_archerion.jpg), and I start sketching and I done an ink after that I did color. This was happen!!!!!!!
I don’t know it was wrong and am not done swiping or tracing. I just took as a reference and I draw it……. Now I think myself bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Once again my apologize to ever one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Happen is happen........ for that apologizes and one more thing am not going anywhere... I stay here and I'll make good name again!!!!!!!!!!

[Beastie]

First I apologized!!!!!!!!!!!To ever one!!!!!

I agree with you guys, yes I referenced Jim lee work......Before that I wanna talk. See when I start drawing for the tournament. I think I wanna draw Maul vs. Colossus and I start sketching a lot, not this one and I tried lot but am not happy. I have an idea in my mind. It’s an action scene, so on that time I need a reference for Anatomy and I searched in net but didn’t get anything on that day (May 2). After that I brought an Anatomy Books (May 3). Again I start sketching but this time I think something missing in my art, so again I start searching on net for reference. But this I found a reference of pic, it was done by Jim lee and one more thing what think in my mind of action of maul and colossus for sketch, it’s same but little different. Same action of maul and colossus what I was think ed and I asked my friends. (Hey dude same action scene I was think Ed, and my friends said. Hey just draw it, it was like reference dude) (may3). On that time I think myself it was not like stealing….. I just think like what Archerion did link 1 (http://th08.deviantart.com/fs43/300W/f/2009/057/e/5/Hattori_Hanzo__s_Grandchild_by_WASIOLKA.jpg) and link 2 (http://th05.deviantart.com/fs41/300W/i/2009/032/3/a/Warrior_by_archerion.jpg) was did on his pic and I start sketching and I done an ink after that I did color. This was happen!!!!!!!
I don’t know it was wrong and am not done swiping or tracing. I just took as a reference and I draw it……. I think myself bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Once again I apologize to ever one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Happen is happen........ for that apologizes and one more thing am not going anywhere... I stay here and I'll make good name again!!!!!!!!!!


What a load of bull.

Loston's lay-over shows that you practically TRACED the pic - let alone 'referencing'.

Your apology is tainted with MORE lies.

Just be honest.

You traced it.

Did you trace the Mr Freeze piece as well?

And hearing you say that you 'didn't know it was wrong' makes me piss myself with laughter!

Seriously. Grow a pair of balls.

[SilverSkies]

What a load of bull.

Loston's lay-over shows that you practically TRACED the pic - let alone 'referencing'.

Your apology is tainted with MORE lies.

Just be honest.

You traced it.

Did you trace the Mr Freeze piece as well?

And hearing you say that you 'didn't know it was wrong' makes me piss myself with laughter!

Seriously. Grow a pair of balls.

yes!!!!! and you think I lied....ok mistake is on my side!!!!!!!!
anyway thanks!!!

[Beastie]

yes!!!!! and you think I lied....ok mistake is on my side!!!!!!!!
anyway thanks!!!

I know English isn't your first language - but I've no idea what you're saying.

I think you are a cheat and a liar, yes. I'm glad thats clear.

Basically, what I want to hear from you is 'yes, I've cheated and traced other people's work to make my entry' and 'I've cheated before as well - including 'my' Mr Freeze piece'.

Thats the only thing you could say that would strike me as being honest.

Everything you've spouted above is just more nonsense and crap about 'referencing'. Its laughable.

[shawny]

well, the kid got caught (good investigating!) but i think we can let this die. im sure he'll learn from it.

[SilverSkies]

yes my first language is austronesian and for ever thing my apologizes..........

[Ugga Bugga]

There is no need for a stake burning here. However Silverskies, If I recall correctly, this is the second time that there has been an issue. I recall a circumstance where you were voting multiple times for your own entry in a draw-off.

You are someone that has made strides in your work. You have advanced. Stop cutting corners. It will get you nowhere.

[SilverSkies]

There is no need for a stake burning here. However Silverskies, If I recall correctly, this is the second time that there has been an issue. I recall a circumstance where you were voting multiple times for your own entry in a draw-off.

You are someone that has made strides in your work. You have advanced. Stop cutting corners. It will get you nowhere.

now I learned and apologizes!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dfbovey]

Referencing something, doesn't mean you find an image in a comicbook or magazine and trace or redraw the entire thing line for line.

The proper and most ethical way to use reference, is to have an idea of what you want to illustrate... lay out your composition roughly and seek reference here and there as it's needed. Having trouble with a certain facial expression? Look in the mirror or grab a magazine. Having trouble drawing an arm in a specific position? look in the mirror, look in a magazine or see how some other artist would have handled it.

Maybe you didn't know right from wrong, but really you'll never improve if you don't branch out and try to be your own person... draw your own ideas from your head. Seek aid when you need to, don't steal other people's work.

[makoi]

First I apologized!!!!!!!!!!!To ever one!!!!!

I agree with you guys, yes I referenced Jim lee work......Before that I wanna talk. See when I start drawing for the tournament. I think I wanna draw Maul vs. Colossus and I start sketching a lot, not this one and I tried lot but am not happy. I have an idea in my mind. It’s an action scene, so on that time I need a reference for Anatomy and I searched in net but didn’t get anything on that day (May 2). After that I brought an Anatomy Books (May 3). Again I start sketching but this time I think something missing in my art, so again I start searching on net for reference. But this I found a reference of pic, it was done by Jim lee and one more thing what think in my mind of action of maul and colossus for sketch, it’s same but little different. Same action of maul and colossus what I was think ed and I asked my friends. (Hey dude same action scene I was think Ed, and my friends said. Hey just draw it, it was like reference dude) (may3). On that time I think myself it was not like stealing….. I just think like Archerion did his pic link 1 (http://th08.deviantart.com/fs43/300W/f/2009/057/e/5/Hattori_Hanzo__s_Grandchild_by_WASIOLKA.jpg) and link 2 (http://th05.deviantart.com/fs41/300W/i/2009/032/3/a/Warrior_by_archerion.jpg), and I start sketching and I done an ink after that I did color. This was happen!!!!!!!
I don’t know it was wrong and am not done swiping or tracing. I just took as a reference and I draw it……. Now I think myself bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Once again my apologize to ever one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Happen is happen........ for that apologizes and one more thing am not going anywhere... I stay here and I'll make good name again!!!!!!!!!!


Apologize you did. Lesson I hope you learned (http://blogs.fayobserver.com/faytoz/files/2008/08/yoda.jpg).

[SilverSkies]

Referencing something, doesn't mean you find an image in a comicbook or magazine and trace or redraw the entire thing line for line.

The proper and most ethical way to use reference, is to have an idea of what you want to illustrate... lay out your composition roughly and seek reference here and there as it's needed. Having trouble with a certain facial expression? Look in the mirror or grab a magazine. Having trouble drawing an arm in a specific position? look in the mirror, look in a magazine or see how some other artist would have handled it.

Maybe you didn't know right from wrong, but really you'll never improve if you don't branch out and try to be your own person... draw your own ideas from your head. Seek aid when you need to, don't steal other people's work.

Sorry!!!!!!!!! I learned!!!!!!!

[Anubis2kx]

Hahahaha....I don't know if you did this or what...but having your real name as 'cheater' and saying that your art is 'inspired' by jim lee is classic....wow...

http://www.penciljack.com/forum/member.php?u=13456