Can a Light Saber cut through Captain Americas Shield?

[50%grey]

The most popular debate from IRC comes to Penciljack! :p

[Huerta]

HELL YES IT CAN! just looks like it could

[misfitX]

well there's so many factors to deal with in this equation. first off the sheild is adamantium alloy so that makes it retardedly hard to destroy. but perhaps a laser can indeed break it apart at the nessacary heat levels. but just how powerful is a lightsabre? sure it can cut through metal designed to deal with a vaccum, but what about different powerlevels and...wait...WHAT THE ****?? :mad:

i said no ultimately since a light sabre exists in the mind of george lucas. its a fantasy world where concentrated light inexplicably stops at three feet from it's source. whereas the sheild works in a more realistic world where a man dresses in armour and throws a giant metal disc around like a boomarang for the betterment of his country. :cool:

ok i said i know be to an ass... :o

[Akira X]

This is such a stupid question.

OF COURSE a lightsaber can cut through adamantium! Its a sword made out of PURE ENERGY. Its not a matter of if its a matter of when. It'd just heat the metal until it is soft enough to be pushed out of the way. The only problem is finding something strong enough to support the shield as it is being repelled by the saber.

[50%grey]

The REAL question is are we talking about before or after the Beyonder destroyed and reassembled the shield during the Secret Wars?

We all know that after the Beyonder recreated it there was a submolecular flaw in the adamantium-vibranium alloy and it became vulnerable.

The new photonic energy shield with a flexible containment matrix Cap. America got after his first shield broke could take the brunt of the lightsaber attack due to the photon composition of both the weapons.



OK, in the Marvel Universe the two most powerful artifacts on planet Earth are Caps shield and Thor's hammer.

Cap's sheild is made of an adamanatium/vibrainum alloy. Completly unique in the universe. In the 1980's Marvel Superheroes RPG it had a tensil strength of Class 3000.
Whereas adamantium was Class 1000 and vibrainium was Shift X (150)

Thor's Hammer was composed of two parts, the head was made of Uru a metal from the storm giants mountains which was forged by goblins and the shaft was composed from the wood of Ydgrassil the World Tree. Both these pieces were bonded by the powerful magicks of the All Father Odin. Mjolinr's tensil strength is Class 3000.

Now unfortunately since I posted on this thread , that insures that I will not be getting laid tonight. My girlfriend may not know of this thread but she will know that I did something that makes me unf!ckable.
The End

[Inkthinker]

its a fantasy world where concentrated light inexplicably stops at three feet from it's source


Actually the beam is contained in a field which draws it back to the source at a specified distance, if I'm not mistaken. The blade is actually not a line, but rather a very long, thin horseshoe shape.

Dammit, the tape on my glasses just broke.

[Digital Klown]

Actually, this sounds like a job for "Hey! Spring of Trivia." It's similar to an episode where they determine whether a high pressure water cutter can cut through a samurai sword. There was even an awesome clip of the samurai sword slicing through a bullet that was fired at it.

Is there anything in our world that closely mimics lightsabers and Cap's shield? Perhaps, someone should set up a Mythbusters-like test/experiment.

[Inkthinker]

A plasma torch turned all the way up to it's highest setting might recreate a lightsaber's effect, but I can't think of anything that approximates adamantium.

What's the melting point of adamantium? Have they ever said?

[Nehemiah]

This is such a stupid question.

OF COURSE a lightsaber can cut through adamantium! Its a sword made out of PURE ENERGY. Its not a matter of if its a matter of when. It'd just heat the metal until it is soft enough to be pushed out of the way. The only problem is finding something strong enough to support the shield as it is being repelled by the saber.

Like Cap's arm.

Muha.

[Spooko]

Course it can!

[Ugga Bugga]

Is this really the place I hang out online? Crap. I'm a nerd. :(

[Spectre-7]

Nope... Adamantium is that butch. A jedi would still kick Cap's ass, though. The jedi would just force-push the shield out of the way, and then it's barbecue time.

[Stark Raving]

Yes. It would cut through that shield like a burrito through your colon.

[Johnny Blaque]

No it couldn't. Vibranium can like vibrate and stuff and something would do that thing or something.

Short answer, No a lightsaber can not cut through caps shield.

[Akira X]

Actually the beam is contained in a field which draws it back to the source at a specified distance, if I'm not mistaken. The blade is actually not a line, but rather a very long, thin horseshoe shape.

Dammit, the tape on my glasses just broke.


I think its more like a cylinder of energy contained by a the blade shroud. Like air in a balloon.

[Inkthinker]

Ah, heck, you know this is written down somewhere. But if I actually go look it up... man, I'm too old for this argument. :rolleyes:

*sigh*... I'll find it.

[50%grey]

how ze light saber works..

http://www.howstuffworks.com/lightsaber.htm

Poll's getting close so I'm gona drop the knowledge for the win


A light sabre can not go thru Cap. America's shield.

Precedence:

Kitty Pride can not phase thru Vibranium. Her technical aspects are that her atoms go out of phase basically temporarily removing the bonds between molecules, thus allowing her to pass through solid objects. She is more or less 1 atom thick with energy levels, similar to the way the way some waves of energy pass through the earth as well the magnetic shield of the earth.

To this degree a light sabre made of mostly single photon energy would have the same basic conceptual struture as a single atom passing by another. The photon energy would rebound sinilar to Kitty Pride's phasing abilities.

Reference Spider-Man and his amazing friends (Xmen team up)

The issue is that Light sabers are technical in nature, not supernatural, etc. As such they must comply with the laws of physics as defined by their respective universe.


Light saber’s as such fall into either particle or wave based creation (or in between like photonic energy). As such they are required to follow the limitations set by the laws of physics that apply to those aspects.

As far as the way Cap's shield works with kinetic energy, one of the more accepted versions is this: vibranium

Another version is this .... A metal that exists in two forms. Wakandan vibranium absorbs vibrational energy (e.g. sound). The more energy it stores the tougher it becomes, due to the energy reinforcing its molecular bonds. If the bonds are broken, all the energy is released, causing an explosion. It is found only in the African nation of Wakanda, ruled by the Black Panther. The other form, Antarctic vibranium, emits a vibration that separates the bonds of other metals, liquifying them.

Cap. America's shield has also reflected laser beams almost since the first incarnation of the character, at all heat levels.

In short .... if the energy from a light sabre is based in a wave or particle form it will be absorbed or reflected. If it is some out of phase version, similar to Kitty Pryde then is will be stopped.

A quote from Marvel Universe ... It is virtually indestructible: it is resistant to penetration, temperature extremes, and the entire electromagnetic spectrum of radiation. The only way it can be damaged in any way is by tampering with its molecular bonding.

OMG FACE!

[cory w.]

You're all dweebs.

p.s. I voted yes.

[Johnny Blaque]

how ze light saber works..

http://www.howstuffworks.com/lightsaber.htm



Can I get a BOOYAH? :D

[vinnlander1313]

**all kinds of nerd speak that actually clears this shit up.**dammit, I WANNA CHANGE MY ANSWER! i voted yes. now i think no. cap, i am sorry i ever doubted you. something else for you mouth breathers to think on, remember what a hard time qui gon's light saber was having with the blast doors on newt gunray's ship in episode 1? yeah, it was cutting it, but it was slow goin. i am thinking those doors were something much flimsier than adamantium/vibranium. i know the pole cant be altered, but if you want an accurate measure, drop one vote down from yes to no cuz i just done switched sides.

[vinnlander1313]

Actually the beam is contained in a field which draws it back to the source at a specified distance, if I'm not mistaken. The blade is actually not a line, but rather a very long, thin horseshoe shape.

Dammit, the tape on my glasses just broke.
please confirm if this is true, because i came to the same conclusion while musing upon the physics of a lightsaber and it would be sweet if i got it right in one try, it would make my momma proud.

[Inkthinker]

how ze light saber works..

http://www.howstuffworks.com/lightsaber.htm

I don't think that article actually says anything about the actual shape of the blade (corkscrew or horseshoe), but I'm willing to accept that Cap's shield could resist it.

[...o...k....]

in·de·struc·ti·ble
Pronunciation: -'str&k-t&-b&l
Function: adjective
Etymology: probably from Late Latin indestructibilis, from Latin in- + destructus, past participle of destruere to tear down -- more at DESTROY
: incapable of being destroyed, ruined, or rendered ineffective



No way can a light saber cut Cap's shield.

[misfitX]

i knew it couldn't be. there's no way. is the sheild made out of vibranium? i thought it was adamantium. damn i even forgot that the Beyonder did all that and i have that series!


by the way, there's a book called the science of star wars i think, yeah here it (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312263872/qid=1115523028/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/104-5047459-4347925) is.

also, for those who care, there's also a book called science of the x-men (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0743487257/qid=1115523161/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/104-5047459-4347925) which is quite interesting and explains that the only way that cyclops could have the power that he is, is that he has (shut up) a tiny black hole in his head. only way it'll work.

now, if you'll excuse me, my mom wants me to clean up my action figures. shut up!

[turnbolt]

Without getting too scientific and droning on and on... I will simply refer to the beginning of episode 1 where they must cut through the blast doors...

It took time...

Basically if the shield was sitting in a vice in a metal shop... and you were trying to make something else out of it... and a light saber was your tool to use... maybe over a period of time you could do it...

(and yes I read the vibranium thing... but the final step in the light saber creation process occurs with the creators use of the force... so there is a little bit more than techy stuff going on there... if a jedi were powerful enough he may be able to generate a light saber capable of cutting said metal in a long enough duration...)

But in combat... there is no way! Cap and the Jedi in question would have to be standing still with saber and shield against each other for a loooooooooooooooooong time... So for practical purposes of the discussion... one must assume the question is basically intended for a combat situation in which... from the examples we have seen... no... it wouldn't happen...

[Akira X]

I don't think that article actually says anything about the actual shape of the blade (corkscrew or horseshoe), but I'm willing to accept that Cap's shield could resist it.

I don't think the energy goes back into the emitter. Everything in the handle is built to refine and project the energy outward, if it went back in it'd destroy itself.

And for the record, a lightsaber isn't made out of light or photons or anything like that, its just energy that glows. Dammit, Deej, isn't your road trip over yet? I saw you logged on you bastard, end this!

[Spooko]

The only thing that can stop a lightsaber is another lightsaber, his shield is not a lightsaber, Fin!

[Inkthinker]

The only thing that can stop a lightsaber is another lightsaber, his shield is not a lightsaber, Fin!


That's not true... cortosis ore interferes with the saber's blade. And as noted, some things may be melted or cut but it takes much time. I believe in Episode III Grievious's droid guards are armed with some sort of staff that deflects lightsaber blades as well.

[Spidey]

So according to Marvel's answer it depends on what type of energy the lightsaber is made of right?

[Inkthinker]

I don't think the energy goes back into the emitter. Everything in the handle is built to refine and project the energy outward, if it went back in it'd destroy itself.


I'm almost positive I've read this somewhere, though... the energy does return to the emitter, and is cycled back out... think of it like a chainsaw blade, maybe that's a better analogy.

I know I read this somewhere, maybe in one of the roleplaying books or something... I remember it specifically because I don't much care for the concept, I rather imagined it as a solid beam myself, but it was in some sort of context that cited this as canon, so I was irritated about it.

But I can't remember where in my vast library of geekery that I read this useless bit of formerly-useful-brain-occupying trivia

[Logan Fray]

Someone should write a script about this and take it to community projects.

[Ra Havok]

Who cares if a lightsaber could or could not cut through Captain America's shield, the good Captain wouldn't last for long against a jedi. Let alone a SITH!!!!

[/Nerd talk]

[DrVictorVonDoom]

Arguing whether one mad-up science is cooler than another made-up science, when both are presented to be the "coolest" by their repective proponents, seems more than a little pointless.


And it's also really geeky.

[Spooko]

Arguing whether one mad-up science is cooler than another made-up science, when both are presented to be the "coolest" by their repective proponents, seems more than a little pointless.


And it's also really geeky.


I think YOU`RE a Star Trek fan! :p

[DrVictorVonDoom]

LOLOLOLOLOL

[Johnny Blaque]

Will you folks stop living on that river in Africa?

There is pretty solid evidence "scientific" evidence that a lightsaber can't cut through Caps shield yet the polls still suck.

:cool:

[Inkthinker]

Arguing whether one mad-up science is cooler than another made-up science, when both are presented to be the "coolest" by their repective proponents, seems more than a little pointless.


And it's also really geeky.

Well, duhhhhhh, Captain Obvious! I suggest that YOUR shield would melt like hot artificial butter-flavored grease under a welding torch if pitted against a lightsaber.

You explain punchlines, too, don't you?

:D

[GIGAFATTYMON]

http://www.bodyknox.btinternet.co.uk/Saber.gif

[vinnlander1313]

lol. very well played, espescially the part where you made captain America speak british.

[DrVictorVonDoom]

Well, duhhhhhh, Captain Obvious! I suggest that YOUR shield would melt like hot artificial butter-flavored grease under a welding torch if pitted against a lightsaber.

You explain punchlines, too, don't you?

:D
Shut up, you meanie.

[Inkthinker]

Well, if nothing else, we inspired a comic strip. Well done, cookies for everyone!

[FIG]

......Now unfortunately since I posted on this thread , that insures that I will not be getting laid tonight. My girlfriend may not know of this thread but she will know that I did something that makes me unf!ckable.
The End

Best ending ever. :D

[vinnlander1313]

yeah, i forgot to give that post it's props. funny shit.

[Kaligula]

I hate and love you guys all at the same time.

[nate lovett]

I hate and love you guys all at the same time.



we hate and love you too, khary. :D

[misfitX]

welp, i'm spent

[dfbovey]

Are all Light Sabers the same strength or do they vary depending on the skill of the Jedi?

[Huerta]

There is a yellow light sabre that can cut thru other light sabres!?!?!?! :eek:

[Johnny Blaque]

that guy is screwed in a fight.

[amadarwin]

in·de·struc·ti·ble
Pronunciation: -'str&k-t&-b&l
Function: adjective
Etymology: probably from Late Latin indestructibilis, from Latin in- + destructus, past participle of destruere to tear down -- more at DESTROY
: incapable of being destroyed, ruined, or rendered ineffective



No way can a light saber cut Cap's shield.

vir·tu·al·ly
Pronunciation: (vûrch--l)
adv.

:Almost but not quite; nearly: “Virtually everyone gets a headache now and then” (People).

the question was CAN a lightsabre cut through Cap's shield. There was no inference of time or situation. As we've seen with Blast Doors, a sabre can cut through anything if given time.


...you can plunge the blade of your lightsaber straight into the door and then melt your way through it to cut out an opening. This normally takes several minutes, but the results are most impressive to anyone on the other side of the blast door.

Cap's losing a shield.

[Akira X]

Are all Light Sabers the same strength or do they vary depending on the skill of the Jedi?

The beam itself is the same type of energy all around. The only thing I can think of is if one of them is running out of power and starts to fizzle out. Otherwise, I'm sure the stronger Jedi could break the handle of the other's saber by applying enough force on the beam (provided the other Jedi was strong enough to hold onto it still) Kind of like when someone's arm breaks in an arm wrestling match.

[Logan]

if this was a straight up technical spec issue, cap would win.. at least so long as the jedi in question was dumb enough to try and burn through it slowly and not use his force-given ..uh.. force to beat cap.


but it's not. when a jedi focuses their will-power through the saber, it becomes an extension of the force.. ie: supernatural


cap bites the dust. trust me, i AM a jedi knight after all :rolleyes:

[NickRocks]

im a jedi ninja.

[xadrian]

For those who care still...

A lightsaber is powered by some made up powersource that has a huge about of kw hours. That power source sends a current through a set of Adegan crystals (amplifiers) and then through a ring at the top. Think of an arc of electricity between two nodes, now imagine that so long and skinny that it almost looks like a single line of energy. There's a control on the grip that allows you to control the length of the arc and the power released.

I'm pretty sure it would cut through any man mad material or naturally occuring, non-force/magic embued substance, given enough time. The magic of the lightsaber is not its cutting power, but how the user wields it. It's a focusing instrument as well as a weapon.

Funny as it is, gigga's cartoon is a perfect example.

[dmario]

well...


well...


WHAT ABOUT The Sword of Omens or Hemans Power Sword!!!

[Akira X]

The magic of the lightsaber is not its cutting power, but how the user wields it. It's a focusing instrument as well as a weapon.

Yeah, the blade causes a gyroscopic effect that makes it take a lot of concentration to even hold still. Thus making it impossible for non-Jedi to wield (with the exception of droids apparently).

[xadrian]

Some can be built with a gyroscoping countering device to limit the arcfield's influence. Also, a droid could be built strong than an average person.

But I see you've read up on the same stuff I have. :)

[vinnlander1313]

VI-
BRA-
NIUM!!!!!!!!

seriously, did you guys not read what 50% posted about its effects on energy or did you just not understand it? IDIOTS!

[Akira X]

VI-
BRA-
NIUM!!!!!!!!

seriously, did you guys not read what 50% posted about its effects on energy or did you just not understand it? IDIOTS!


Except that vibranium doesn't make ANY SENSE whatsoever. Its like... I make up Glueium! When you say "pumpkin pie in the sky" its molecular bonds glue you to things! Yeah! Nevermind thats not based on any kind of science whatsoever, its true! Vibranium deflects my balls! How do you even forge vibranium? You can't melt it since instead of energy causing the molecules to move and loosen it causes their bond to tighten, and if you kept trying apparently it'd explode.

[Ugga Bugga]

Vibranium deflects my balls!

From what?????

[vinnlander1313]

nate. that lightsaber you bought at walmart, its not a real light saber. you know why? because lightsabers arent real either. sorry. if marvel says that vibranium either reflects or absorbs energy, then thats it. thats what it does. dont get me wrong. if the beyonder came to earth and said i could either have a lightsaber or caps' shield, i would take the saber all day long but based on the made up sciences we have referenced, cap's shield could withstand a lightsaber.


anyway, lets take this to the next level. we all know it is going there anyway. lightsaber vs. mjolnir. someone give us the specs on uru and ygdrassil wood.

[Inkthinker]

well...


well...


WHAT ABOUT The Sword of Omens or Hemans Power Sword!!!


Nah... but the Sword of Omens might let you see yourself getting beat down by Cap for trying to scratch his gear up.

[dmario]

Nah... but the Sword of Omens might let you see yourself getting beat down by Cap for trying to scratch his gear up.


wait...ULtimate Cap or regular continuity cap?

[The unknown artist]

blah...i should have taken the time to read the whole topic before I posted.

[50%grey]

K.
no.1 Whatever you are thinking = no.
no.2 Snakeeyes w/ Thor's Hammer and the Infinity Gauntlet would whoop the sh!t out of Neo in the Matrix w/ a lightsaber.
no.3 Captain America's shield would not get cut in half by a lightsaber, But that f@ggot wolverine would.
no.4 Thor is a God. He'd kick the shit out of Yoda.
no.5 Megatron w/ Captain America's shield would f*cking own Master Splinter WITH a lightsaber.
finally
no.6 - Luke Skywalker w/ 2 lightsaber's during Yuuzhon Vong invasion vs. He-man with the Sword of Power IN Castle Grayskull would win. ONLY if he has r2d2 backing him up with a spare lightsaber since He-man has the Sorceress AND Battlecat.

Yeah dont step to this cause you'll get JABRONIED!

[50%grey]

oh
and

Thor's Hammer would regulate a Jedi, Jedi is human. Thor is divine. You are a queer loving hippy f@ggot if you say so otherwise.
Btw, Voltron w/ a lightsaber AND Blazing sword would lose to Optimus Prime w/ Thor's Hammer and Matrix of Leadership transformed into a Mace.

Thx

[NickRocks]

K.
no.1 Whatever you are thinking = no.
no.2 Snakeeyes w/ Thor's Hammer and the Infinity Gauntlet would whoop the sh!t out of Neo in the Matrix w/ a lightsaber.
no.3 Captain America's shield would not get cut in half by a lightsaber, But that f@ggot wolverine would.
no.4 Thor is a God. He'd kick the shit out of Yoda.
no.5 Megatron w/ Captain America's shield would f*cking own Master Splinter WITH a lightsaber.
finally
no.6 - Luke Skywalker w/ 2 lightsaber's during Yuuzhon Vong invasion vs. He-man with the Sword of Power IN Castle Grayskull would win. ONLY if he has r2d2 backing him up with a spare lightsaber since He-man has the Sorceress AND Battlecat.

Yeah dont step to this cause you'll get JABRONIED!



wtf?!?!?! lol :D :D

[vinnlander1313]

Btw, Voltron w/ a lightsaber AND Blazing sword would lose to Optimus Prime w/ Thor's Hammer and Matrix of Leadership transformed into a Mace.

Thxok, i was with you until that last one. voltron is undefeated with the blazing sword. i seriously dont know why they ever ****ed around fighting robeasts in lion form anyway. just STAY in voltron form and fire up the blazing sword before even setting foot on the battle field. every fight would go: form blazing sword> swing blazing sword at opponent> celebrate victory.

[50%grey]

In the future, when people look back at the Internet, they will remember that when they got to the end, this thread was waiting for them.

[vinnlander1313]

this thread is truly the anti-lay. where is dj anyway? this is usually his thing.


PS. to tie two threads together, i think sho' nuff and bruce leroy were two lower level force users who's kung fu training gave them the ability to harness a remedial form of force lightning, ie "the glow". had they been born in the republic they would have been identified sooner.

[amadarwin]

From what?????

I do believe he's not a father, so you do the math. ;)

[Spectre-7]

Re No2. - Thor's hammer and the Infinity Gauntlet are "real", thus being completely useless in the virtual world of the Matrix, where Neo is like unto a god. Neo would kick SnakeEye's ass if the fight occured in the Matrix, and he wouldn't bother with a lightsaber... Just code hack him, and blow him into a billion pieces.

Re No5. - Megatron with Cap's shield? Wouldn't it be like a thimble to him? Splinter with a lightsaber whips his ass. Classic Megatron's only real fighting abilities were long range, which Splinter could easily deflect with a lightsaber, allowing him to close range and slice the big metal tonka-toy to bits. QED.

:D

[cory w.]

You're the biggest ****ing dorks in town.

Also, do you dweebs need to be reminded that the question wasn't whether a jedi could beat captain america or not (which a jedi could), but whether or not a lightsaber could cut through the shield (which a lightsaber would).

[dmario]

this thread is oozing with anti-sex

[DJ Kenobi]

I’ve been out of town, but here’s what I got. My first reaction was that I was fine with the concept that given enough time, a lightsaber could potentially melt into Cap’s shield, but that in a combat situation it would have no effect. But there was a sentence in this post (http://www.penciljack.com/forum/showpost.php?p=603289&postcount=17) that bothered me.

“Wakandan vibranium absorbs vibrational energy (e.g. sound). The more energy it stores the tougher it becomes, due to the energy reinforcing its molecular bonds. If the bonds are broken, all the energy is released, causing an explosion.”
That’s not the way molecular bonds work when energy is added to a stable system. For any stable molecular bond, the electrons exist in their ground state, the lowest energy shell that promotes stability. Adding energy excites electrons temporarily into a higher energy shell, but that electron will succumb to the pull of the nucleus and the repulsion of the molecules surrounding it and it will return to its original energy shell releasing a photon in the process. That is how emission spectrum testing works.

If vibranium were somehow able to continually accept and store energy without the electrons falling back to their ground state, that would actually weaken the molecular bonds. The vibranium electrons would be excited to higher energy levels throughout the metal, the higher energy shells are more distant from the nucleus and the molecule itself is farther from its most stable form. Also, the closer the electrons to the nuclei, the potentially stronger bonds it can form.

This is all based off the idea of molecular bonds, which is what the quote says. Metallic bonds are slightly different, forming delocalised bonding. Instead of each molecule or atom having its electron attached to its nuclei, the electrons delocalise into a sea of electrons spread over the metal. There are a whole slew of forces at work in metallic bonding too numerous to go into here that deals with electrons, free ions, conductivity, etc. But what it all comes down to is that adding energy weakens metal, perhaps not at first, but once a boiling point is reached the bonds break. If a metal were to continually be storing energy it would be slowly moving itself toward melting instead of becoming stronger.

What does this all mean? Vibranium makes no sense according to science and therefore I think that a lightsaber could indeed cut through Cap’s shield.

NOTE: It’s been a few years since I’ve had solid state/inorganic chem so though I may not be perfect in that explanation, but it should be darn close.

[vinnlander1313]

well, you certainly know a lot about how chemistry works in the real world, but in a fantasy world the rules can be broken or bent. are vibranium and it's traits possible? no. but in a fictitious world, there may be forces of nature (scientific) that we either do not have, or have not discovered yet in real world physics. to our knowledge there is no way to create light energy that goes out 3 feet, makes an about feet, and returns to its power source. let alone the logistics of a power source strong and small enough to fit into a hilt and power said blade. all we can go on is the general rules that each universe sets up (yes nate, makes up off of the top of their heads for fiction's sake) for the device and stop at the point where it starts to not make real sense (perhaps the traits of vibranium lay in some unique form of sub atomic particle we have not discovered yet that is unique to this substance). by the physics rules of the marvel universe, vibranium has certain physical properties. these physical properties cause it to be invulnerable to energy based weapons. the lightsaber is an energy based weapon. ie: a light saber can NOT cut through caps shield. but yes, by real world physics, i would bank on light saber technology (though probably not kayber crystal based) arriving before something resembling vibranium (which is impossible) is ever created, so by real world standards, energy weapon trumps tough metal. the thing is, we are dealing with fantasy physics. its cap's shield all day.

[Akira X]

Vibranium contradicts the laws of physics, while lightsabers don't because they're based on technology beyond our own, at least they don't include a material that can't exist. Comics make for sloppy science fiction. You can't make up for the shortcomings of Stan Lee by excluding the laws of physics of the Star Wars universe. No one said that the playing ground was the Marvel universe, also you're a fat dummy butthead.

[DJ Kenobi]

Well, dealing with fantasy physics... I would have to say that I think a lightsaber could potentially melt into Cap’s shield given enough time, but that in a combat situation Cap's shield would be able to deflect direct blows from a lightsaber with little to no damage.

[vinnlander1313]

correction. KNOWN laws of physics. the light saber also contradicts the known laws of physics in that light, uh... goes out and doesnt come back. LOL. this thread makes me feel unclean. for this battle to take place, we need a battle ground where they both can exist. vibranium without the properties of vibranium is not vibranium. the impossible properties of vibranium have to come into play here. see my point dunder-pants?

[Akira X]

Fine, but a lightsaber isn't made out of light, its just "generic pure energy of ____ type/quality". Lightsaber is just a name because it glows.

[Spooko]

correction. KNOWN laws of physics. the light saber also contradicts the known laws of physics in that light, uh... goes out and doesnt come back. LOL. this thread makes me feel unclean. for this battle to take place, we need a battle ground where they both can exist. vibranium without the properties of vibranium is not vibranium. the impossible properties of vibranium have to come into play here. see my point dunder-pants?

Lightsabers are not made of light, if it were just light it wouldnt do anything, when was the last time a flashlight hurt you? =p

A Lightsaber is pure energy contained and focused in a cylinder like shape, or perhaps a shaft . So its like having the power of a star concentrated into the shape of a shaft (much like my own anatomy) Though in real life I doubt lightsabers would even stop one another from passing through each other, they would definately tear up anything infront of them. Though I doubt anyone would be able to hold one, but if they could made up material or not the only thing stronger than a star is gravity so unless his shield is a black hole manifested in the form of a shield I think it would cut through.

[DJ Kenobi]

Ok, over at this website
http://www.marveldirectory.com/misc/vibranium.htm
they say that there is precedence that vibranium can only absorb so much energy.
There are limits to the capacity of Vibranium to absorb vibratory energy, although the exact extent of these limits has not yet been determined. For example, in recent years the oil conglomerate Roxxon discovered that a certain small island in the South Atlantic had a foundation composed of Wakandan Vibranium. Roxxon found it necessary to destroy the island and blew it up with bombs. Unable to absorb the force of the explosion, the Vibranium was destroyed, but it did succeed in entirely absorbing the sound made by the explosion.
Therefore momentary impact by a lightsaber as would happen during a battle would probably not transfer enough energy to force an explosion. However, prolonged contact with a lightsaber would be transfering incredible amounts of energy that I believe could force an explosion. So I change my answer to saying that the during normal one-on-one battle, Cap's shield would hold up just fine, but given time and opportunity Cap's shield could be destroyed by a lightsaber.

[Huerta]

29 say YES IT CAN!!!! so it's oVAAAAA

[vinnlander1313]

29 say YES IT CAN!!!! so it's oVAAAAA
the truth is not determined by a democracy.

[vinnlander1313]

also, we should try to nail down what type of energy a light saber is. is it heat energy? light energy? some other unknown type of energy either way, i refer you back to fiddy%'s post.


In short .... if the energy from a light sabre is based in a wave or particle form it will be absorbed or reflected. If it is some out of phase version, similar to Kitty Pryde then is will be stopped

even ignoring that, we still have to answer how MUCH energy do lightsaber's put out? perhaps the bonds of cap's vibranium shield could be undone by a nuclear warhead (the island example), but does the light saber pack that kind of power? also, we are forgetting that caps shield is not JUST vibranium. it is also adamantium. it is an alloy, and perhaps the combination of the two makes it exponentially stronger than either adamantium or vibranium alone. the example of the wakandan island's destruction might not apply to cap's shield at all. maybe his shield is tougher than even that.

[Stark Raving]

Comics make for sloppy science fiction.
Except Frank Cho comics. They make for sloppy...something else.

[Stark Raving]

the truth is not determined by a democracy.
Eh, on second thought, I'd better not.

Carry on.

[Akira X]

I was thinking that the adamantium would weaken it since its only 1/3 as strong. And I think wave/particle energy compared to the energy of a lightsaber is like comparing a running garden hose to an icicle.

[astrocity20]

Is this shit really 9 pages? Yeesh.

[Knigge]

the truth is not determined by a democracy.
That's what losers say. :)

The actual truth is nothing would happen, because neither have, do, will, or can exist. If there was any truth to this hypothetical matter then there wouldn't be a poll for it. ;)

[Mase]

...So I change my answer to saying that the during normal one-on-one battle, Cap's shield would hold up just fine, but given time and opportunity Cap's shield could be destroyed by a lightsaber.That sounds good to me.
The best explanation I've heard to explain a lightsabre is that its a small section of a laser-like light wave of incredible amplitude that's directed horizontally. Energy moves in waves that are infinitely small, but they're still waves, so I guess it made sense. Kind of. The blast door part of Episode I always kind of bugged me. Lightsabres cut through metal with zero resistance before that, so it seemed odd that they were suddenly like blowtorches.
Whatever the case, lightsabres are the coolest thing about Star Wars, and giga's comic killed me.

[Knigge]

You said it yourself. They are blast doors. Doors built to withstand blasts. I'd imagine that even a lightsaber would need a bit of time to peel its way through 4 feet of alien metal reinforced by who knows what kind of technology. And there are things in the Star Wars universe that can resist a lightsaber. They aren't the fingers of god.

[DrVictorVonDoom]

Lightsabers do what George Lucas says they'll do...Frankly, I'd assume that they're much better/more consistently dealt with in the EU than in any of the actual movies.

[misfitX]

regardless of what alightsabre can do, i just re-read the JLA/Avengers mini series from mr.s Busiek and Perez and cap's sheild takes a lot of shit in the last battle with superman carrying it around. all kinds of stuff like cosmic powers and whatnot. if that can't scratch it i doubt a lightsabre would be able to.

why am i still doing this?

[vinnlander1313]

regardless of what alightsabre can do, i just re-read the JLA/Avengers mini series from mr.s Busiek and Perez and cap's sheild takes a lot of shit in the last battle with superman carrying it around. all kinds of stuff like cosmic powers and whatnot. if that can't scratch it i doubt a lightsabre would be able to.

why am i still doing this?winnah!!!!

[dmario]

regardless of what alightsabre can do, i just re-read the JLA/Avengers mini series from mr.s Busiek and Perez and cap's sheild takes a lot of shit in the last battle with superman carrying it around. all kinds of stuff like cosmic powers and whatnot. if that can't scratch it i doubt a lightsabre would be able to.

why am i still doing this?


this house....is clean.

[misfitX]

winnah!!!!
w00t! :D

so why is the poll still so lopsided?

[Knigge]

Because the faith in the force is much greater than the faith in America.........................'s Captain.

Mwuhaha. You lose. :p

[vinnlander1313]

w00t! :D

so why is the poll still so lopsided?
because people are wrong. :D

[Ed]

Except that vibranium doesn't make ANY SENSE whatsoever.


must i point out that the physics of a lightsabre dont make sense? they sometimes bounce off eachother, sometimes are locked up in a power struggle. that right there makes no sense. also the lack of hand guard is stupid, whats to stop vader from sliding his sabre down lukes when they get locked up?

the day captian america loses to some metropolis, samurai, blood parasite having wannabe is the day he goes communist.

[vinnlander1313]

must i point out that the physics of a lightsabre dont make sense? they sometimes bounce off eachother, sometimes are locked up in a power struggle. that right there makes no sense. also the lack of hand guard is stupid, whats to stop vader from sliding his sabre down lukes when they get locked up?

the day captian america loses to some metropolis, samurai, blood parasite having wannabe is the day he goes communist.
shit... YOU TELL 'EM ED!!!! midichlorians arent parasitic, they are symbiotic. not to bust balls or anything.
maytheforcebewithyou

[Miss V]

I voted yes because jedis are cool. :D

[Black Ryu]

This thread is so full of quotables it's not even funny.

[vinnlander1313]

This thread is so full of quotables it's not even funny.
i am glad that we have entertained you. now go vote for cap.

[Johnny Blaque]

Vote for Cap! I was right all along! Don't make me pull a Street Team on youse.

[Captain America]

First-They are both fictional, so we can pretend anything we want.
Second-lightsabers are an ancient weapon in another galaxy that may nolonger exist. Cap's shield is in existance. We don't know what the durability of Star Wars metals are in cmparison to earthly metals. They may be totaly weaker or uber strong (by comparison).
Third-how many laser blasts has Cap taken on the sheild and not even the paint was scratched?

So, no it can't. Besides Captain America would finish off any whiny Skywalker who came at him with a lightsaber anyway. Come on... It's CAPTAIN AMERICA!:)

[bushiboy]

Wow Cap, this thread was deader than Bucky USED to be.

Lucas used to say a lightsaber can cut through anything but another lightsaber, but in the last film he changed his mind so I'd say it can cut through anything that's not an energy-based plasmaform.

Oh, right.
May The Force Be With You.

[MC Fumunda]

Ah, man. I forgot about this thread.

Good times.

Nice random resurrection of it, too. And by the Cap himself!

(which in itself creates a hiliarious image)

[Inkthinker]

Cripes... this thread was one of the reasons we set up a whole subsection for these arguments. Which is where I shall move it.

:D

Lightsabers deflect blaster fire rather than absorbing or dispersing it, so it would stand to follow that they're weak against energy forms.

[e_t_i]

When Captain America throws his mighty shield,
All those who choose to oppose his shield must yield!
If he's led to a fight and a duel is due,
Then the red and the white and the blue will come through,
When Captain America throws his mighty shield!

But I digress...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adamantium_%28comics%29#Captain_America.27s_Shield _--_Adamantium_or_Not.3F


For years it has been said that Captain America's shield contained or was made of adamantium, but this is not the case. The process that created this shield was never duplicated and is not understood. It is made of an alloy that includes Wakandan vibranium, steel and an unknown catalyst that allowed the two metals to fuse. It is essentially indestructible, and is even stronger than any known form of adamantium, although it can be damaged or destroyed given extraordinary (even by Marvel Universe standards) force. A mistake often made by readers is that Captain America's shield is made entirely of adamantium, or of vibranium. Since adamantium was not developed until after Captain America was revived from suspended animation, this would be impossible. In fact, the shield's material has radically different properties from either, resulting in far greater resilience. The source of this confusion/error is an entry made in the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe (and repeated many times since), which stated that the shield was an adamantium-vibranium alloy. However, as revealed via retcon in Kurt Busiek's 2001 Avengers Annual , adamantium was created in an attempt to duplicate the material of the shield.

[saint manji]

Your rhyming poem ALMOST convinced me Cap. would win.

[NickRocks]

even if, for some weird reason, the shield was able to repel a lightsaber attack, the jedi would get pissed off and flip out, sliding around the shield. can caps skin stop a lightsaber! IDONTTHINKSOTHANKYOUVERYMUCHCLOSETHEDOORWHENYOULEA VEMAYTHEFORCEBEWITHYOU!

[NickRocks]

this reminds me of those old matrix threads. someone should go revive THOSE.


lol.

[Deth]

Cap would so win against a Jedi and No a lightsaber cannot go through Caps shield.

WHY?

Because Cap would chop off their heads before they got the chance!!!

[NickRocks]

with what? his hand?

[Deth]

Caps used that shield of his to chop off peoples heads. Well, only one guy who was a vampire and could be stopped unless you chopped off his head. BUT, dangit he could do it. especially to that teenaged Anakin.

[NickRocks]

anakin would easily deflect the shield with his lightsaber. if he can stop blaster shots, he can stop caps 58 mph curveball

[saint manji]

If Anakin's skin is as stiff as his acting, cap loses.

[Brian Germain]

well there's so many factors to deal with in this equation. first off the sheild is adamantium alloy so that makes it retardedly hard to destroy. but perhaps a laser can indeed break it apart at the nessacary heat levels. but just how powerful is a lightsabre? sure it can cut through metal designed to deal with a vaccum, but what about different powerlevels and...wait...WHAT THE ****?? :mad:

i said no ultimately since a light sabre exists in the mind of george lucas. its a fantasy world where concentrated light inexplicably stops at three feet from it's source. whereas the sheild works in a more realistic world where a man dresses in armour and throws a giant metal disc around like a boomarang for the betterment of his country. :cool:

ok i said i know be to an ass... :o


well here's the deal Cap's shield is made of an Adamantium /VIBRANIUM Alloy which is similar in strength to thors URU hammer. I have only seen caps shield broken a couple times but they were by people like thanos.. Anyway since the strength of a lightsaber depends on the force strength of the wielder I would have to say yes but only in the hands of someone like yoda or vader or someone equally powerful and I don't think it could cut through easily I think it would be like when they melted through the doors on the ships it would be gradual...

ok now it's official my geek badge just came in the mail lol

[Brian Germain]

A plasma torch turned all the way up to it's highest setting might recreate a lightsaber's effect, but I can't think of anything that approximates adamantium.

What's the melting point of adamantium? Have they ever said?


well there are adamantine rocks. but to make an alloy from them.. I think the strongest metal we have now is titanium

-Brian Germain

[Brian Germain]

anakin would easily deflect the shield with his lightsaber. if he can stop blaster shots, he can stop caps 58 mph curveball


Nah I have to disagree here.. cap is waaay too smart for being out done by a fancy lightsaber master... here's how it would go down Cap would Deftly Dodge and block with his shield the lightsabre not going completely through it because the contact would be quick and minimal instead it leaves little scorche marks on the surface, next caop throws his shield at an angle so it goes past the jedi, the jedi thinks he missed and is home free, being every bit a martial master as a jedi and haveing years upon years of different styles of combat experience. cap thinks ahead and the missed shield tactic was really to ricochet it off a couple surfaces behind the jedi and come right back to hit him in the head. The jedi is no slouch though and the force lets him know that there is an object coming at him (much like a spidey sense) and a quick force push sends it away, but too late cap is inside and landing blows that feel like he has fast moving cinder block for hands the jedi is pummeled but jumping back at an inhuman speed ands diistance he is back on the offensive.

Shieldless cap is done for and the Jedi presses in. Swinging a blow cap dodges back and fals to the ground the Jedi has him now, but wait it's a ruse and in a signature cap move the jedi is flung over with caps feet in the (airplane style) kick to the solar plexus. the jedi regains his feet but not before losing his lightsabre!, using the force the sabre flies to his hand just as it is chopped into halves by Caps 110 mile hour throw of his regained shield.

the jedi gapes in astonishment as the lightsaber pieces clatter to the floor his gape is only momentary as he turns in time to see the ricocheted shield clock him in the face lights out jedi!

except for a few minor cuts and scrapes cap will live to fight another die, there is a rather nasty wound on his back from when the sabre glanced him while he was landing blows close inside but good thing it cauterizes as it cuts otherwise Cap might have bled to death.

but that's just the way I see it :)

hehe

-Brian

[dmario]

Your rhyming poem ALMOST convinced me Cap. would win.

you are obviously so young...

[NickRocks]

Nah I have to disagree here.. cap is waaay too smart for being out done by a fancy lightsaber master... here's how it would go down Cap would Deftly Dodge and block with his shield the lightsabre not going completely through it because the contact would be quick and minimal instead it leaves little scorche marks on the surface, next caop throws his shield at an angle so it goes past the jedi, the jedi thinks he missed and is home free, being every bit a martial master as a jedi and haveing years upon years of different styles of combat experience. cap thinks ahead and the missed shield tactic was really to ricochet it off a couple surfaces behind the jedi and come right back to hit him in the head. The jedi is no slouch though and the force lets him know that there is an object coming at him (much like a spidey sense) and a quick force push sends it away, but too late cap is inside and landing blows that feel like he has fast moving cinder block for hands the jedi is pummeled but jumping back at an inhuman speed ands diistance he is back on the offensive.

Shieldless cap is done for and the Jedi presses in. Swinging a blow cap dodges back and fals to the ground the Jedi has him now, but wait it's a ruse and in a signature cap move the jedi is flung over with caps feet in the (airplane style) kick to the solar plexus. the jedi regains his feet but not before losing his lightsabre!, using the force the sabre flies to his hand just as it is chopped into halves by Caps 110 mile hour throw of his regained shield.

the jedi gapes in astonishment as the lightsaber pieces clatter to the floor his gape is only momentary as he turns in time to see the ricocheted shield clock him in the face lights out jedi!

except for a few minor cuts and scrapes cap will live to fight another die, there is a rather nasty wound on his back from when the sabre glanced him while he was landing blows close inside but good thing it cauterizes as it cuts otherwise Cap might have bled to death.

but that's just the way I see it :)

hehe

-Brian


this isnt a story, dude. it goes like this...

cap tosses shield.
jedi has time to laugh, say "wow old man you have NO ARM" fires up saber, deflects shield, then runs in, chops off caps arms, and poops on him.

[e_t_i]

Your rhyming poem ALMOST convinced me Cap. would win.

Thanks. That was from those Captain America/Marvel Superheroes cartoons that I watched as a little kid, and again as a teen. I don't think they've been rerun in a looong time. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002CH7RK/

[e_t_i]

this isnt a story, dude. it goes like this...

cap tosses shield.
jedi has time to laugh, say "wow old man you have NO ARM" fires up saber, deflects shield, then runs in, chops off caps arms, and poops on him.

The way I see it

cap tosses shield.
jedi has time to laugh, say "wow old man you have NO ARM" fires up saber, raises saber to deflect, shield pushes saber into jedi's head creating large opening where jedi's head used to be, cap poops down jedi's throat.

[NickRocks]

hahahaha! im laughing at how wrong you are.

[jdmakescomics]

Anyone who says Cap loses is a communist >_>

[Brian Germain]

A mistake often made by readers is that Captain America's shield is made entirely of adamantium, or of vibranium. Since adamantium was not developed until after Captain America was revived from suspended animation, this would be impossible. In fact, the shield's material has radically different properties from either, resulting in far greater resilience. The source of this confusion/error is an entry made in the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe (and repeated many times since), which stated that the shield was an adamantium-vibranium alloy.



actually this is not a mistake at first it's tru that it was some other type of metal but since his shield was broken by the beyonder during the secret wars it was indeed renmade of an adamantium vibranium alloy.

great another star on my geek flag!

[Brian Germain]

this isnt a story, dude. it goes like this...

cap tosses shield.
jedi has time to laugh, say "wow old man you have NO ARM" fires up saber, deflects shield, then runs in, chops off caps arms, and poops on him.


LOL... and then he wakes up and changes his underwear LOL

I'll give you this if he were fighting vader or obi wan or yoda he may well lose.. but against nearly any other jedi... no dice... my question is how did generoal grevous use a lightsabre? let alone four?


-Brian

[Brian Germain]

hahahaha! im laughing at how wrong you are.


that's true Cap would never poop down someone's throat. it's beneath him lol :D
-Brian

[NickRocks]

Anyone who says Cap loses is a communist >_>

cap loses. not because im a communist, but because i dont want some 60 year old old guy who was frozen in a block of ice to represent MY country. ill take superman, thankyouverymuch.

[saint manji]

Better red than dead, i always say.

[e_t_i]

I shoulda' just posted this in the first place http://youtube.com/watch?v=FA__u4-ha90

[NickRocks]

youtube is getting on my nerves with all its freaking useful random clips

[GRiM]

I didn't bother to read past the first page in this thread, but all I have to say is: I'm not sure. I am, by the way, talking about the poll question, I know the poll is now closed. But anyway, the thing is, there are things that can withstand a lightsaber, such as a vibroblade. So whatever vibroblades are made of, that can withstand a lightsaber. So if adamantium is anything like the metal used for vibroblades, then I guess a lightsaber couldn't cut through it.

So there.

[NickRocks]

dude, what the hell are you talking about?

[Wade8813]

The strongest version of Cap's shield can withstand a lightsaber forever.

Adamantium is made by mixing AD Resin X and AD Resin Y at over 15000 degrees celsius. After the metal cools, not even that temperature can affect the metal.


What's the melting point of adamantium? Have they ever said? There is none.


vir·tu·al·ly
Pronunciation: (vûrch--l)
adv.

:Almost but not quite; nearly: “Virtually everyone gets a headache now and then” (People). The only reason it's "virtually" is because Magneto can reshape it (as he did to Wolverine), and beings like the Celestials who could alter reality at will could turn it into silly putty.

Although I believe the Vibranium makes it resistant to magnetism.

[Brian Germain]

The strongest version of Cap's shield can withstand a lightsaber forever.

Adamantium is made by mixing AD Resin X and AD Resin Y at over 15000 degrees celsius. After the metal cools, not even that temperature can affect the metal.

There is none.

The only reason it's "virtually" is because Magneto can reshape it (as he did to Wolverine), and beings like the Celestials who could alter reality at will could turn it into silly putty.

Although I believe the Vibranium makes it resistant to magnetism.

Ah yes but let us not forget that thanos of titan destroyed it by shattering it and I believe in JLA Avengers the big baddie in there took it out as well... the Vibranium comes from Wakanda I believe which is sitting on a large deposit of it. or if you are an ultimates universe fan the vibranium comes from an alien race as well as wakanda...

I think ever since it has been made from the vibranium adamantum alloy it has only been broken about three times which is pretty dang good compared to the amount of times Thor's unbreakable mystical uru hammer has been broken over the years... it is a testament to human technology even though it is technically a comic book I think it is kind of how Tolkien percieved the hobbits compared to americans and humans in general as being capable of great things if needs be.

-Brian

[Wade8813]

Apparently, when Thanos destroyed it, he was only able to do it because he had the Infinity Gauntlet, which allowed him to alter reality (much like the aforementioned Celestials).

[2-d Disaster]

i think we're forgetting that a lightsabre cant cut through everything! vibroswords are what non-jedis equip to match the lightsabre, and thats just hard metal.... caps shield, being undestructable, would definately match the lightsabre. How much stronger can a vibrosword be than a sheild that's matched all of the marvel universe's technology?

it comes down to technology.... star wars is set in a vastly superior world, even with lucas behind the wheel... but marvel is no slouch either... shi'ar technology....other aliens... i mean, nothings broken it yet!

so all in all, i think that cap would lose a fight to a jedi, but his shield would withstand the hits. I believe a series of sparks would insue after the hit, but the shield would hold nonetheless

[Chris Major]

Apparently, when Thanos destroyed it, he was only able to do it because he had the Infinity Gauntlet, which allowed him to alter reality (much like the aforementioned Celestials).

He didn't need to alter reality to do it.

Cap's virtually indestructible shield < utterly limitless physical and temporal power.

virtually < limitless

[bitterX]

may be we should directly ask george lucas??

heres there plan all we have to do is catch him off gaurd whilst eating pies made out of money encrusted in puff pastry, and i'm sure he will spill his secrets!

[Wade8813]

He didn't need to alter reality to do it.

Cap's virtually indestructible shield < utterly limitless physical and temporal power.

virtually < limitless Do you know that he didn't use the reality gem's power to do it?

Otherwise, it's quite possible that Cap's shield is completely (not virtually) unbreakable unless you alter reality.

As for asking Lucas, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't even know.

[Brian Germain]

I don't know where it says a lightsabre can cut through "anything" but I seen it cut through the ships cargo doors in the movies and I also seen how long it took... about 32 to 3 panels comic time wolverine can usually cut through that stuff in no tame at all like a hot knife through butter but yet he can't outright cut through caps shield so again I think it comes back to the ammount of time the jedi applied the lightsabre to the shield as well as how powerful the jedi was yoda or vader would have a much easier time of it.

-Brian


i think we're forgetting that a lightsabre cant cut through everything! vibroswords are what non-jedis equip to match the lightsabre, and thats just hard metal.... caps shield, being undestructable, would definately match the lightsabre. How much stronger can a vibrosword be than a sheild that's matched all of the marvel universe's technology?

it comes down to technology.... star wars is set in a vastly superior world, even with lucas behind the wheel... but marvel is no slouch either... shi'ar technology....other aliens... i mean, nothings broken it yet!

so all in all, i think that cap would lose a fight to a jedi, but his shield would withstand the hits. I believe a series of sparks would insue after the hit, but the shield would hold nonetheless

[Chris Major]

Do you know that he didn't use the reality gem's power to do it?


As far as I remember (haven't read Infinity Gauntlet in a while), only pure physical strength is involved. No fancy power-invoking, no Gauntlet blast, no reality warping. Pure, brute, downward-descending fist.

My guess is, in combat, a lightsaber would not cut through strike after strike, no matter how long the fight would be. After all, it took some time for Qui-Gon to cut partially through the blast door, and that door was stationary... nevermind much, much less resistant than Cap's shield.

Leave the shield in a Jedi's hands for an extended period of time, and the lightsaber could cut through it. How many hours/days/weeks of continued applied pressure that'd take is really the thing that's up for discussion.


P.S.: For those "let's compare it to mystical stuff 'cause that's so much more powerful than man-made" fans, the Molecule Man destroyed both the Shield and the Hammer of Thor without breaking much of a sweat. So much for mystical properties.

[Rink]

I think it is kind of how Tolkien percieved the hobbits compared to americans and humans in general as being capable of great things if needs be.

Wah??? Tolkien hated Americans. The hobbits are the epitome of how J.R.R viewed England and the English.

You lost your right to call yourself hobbits when you threw our tea in the river.

[penciljack]

He didn't need to alter reality to do it.

Cap's virtually indestructible shield < utterly limitless physical and temporal power.

virtually < limitless
Thanos was only able to break the shield (and go toe to toe with the most powerful of all Marvel characters) by wielding the Infinity Gauntlet.

I say the answer to the poll question is "Yes - given an unlimited amount of time and assuming it is being held relatively still."

[HitNRun]

personally I think a lightsabre could cut through anything..

[50%grey]

This thread must be reborn for the year 2012!

[PTX40]

Um, I'm pretty sure Iron Man's created more damaging crap than a light saber. And if THOSE can't get through Cap's shield, how in the hell would a light saber do it?