The "KIRBY CRACKLE" [Archive]

Bruce Lee

07-25-2002, 08:05 AM

I prepared this little tutorial for a fellow over on Critical Mass who's had difficulty grasping how to construct the "Kirby crackle" (also known as "Kirby dots"). I think it might be of benefit to some of you here also. I can't recall the subject coming up here before, so here goes--

The "Kirby dots" or "crackles" are tough to do--especially if you haven't tried to do them before, or aren't overly familiar with Jack Kirby's work. A lot of comic artists use the "Kirby dots" when conveying massive amounts of energy, but saddly, only a handful seem to really understand the proper way to do it.

I prepared this quick tutorial for you in hopes it would shead some light on the subject:

The first thing I did was to decide where my blast radius would be. In light pencil (in red here, for your convenience) I doodled in the blast radius around the flying vehicle.

The actual "Kirby dots" should take place around the actual projected rays of the blast (indeed it should frame your blast), so with that in mind, the next thing to do is to start adding in the largest "dots." Here, I've started from at the outer most corners of the panel. Notice that the larger "dots" are generally found at the panel's edge. As I move in towards the center of the blast, I make the "dots" slightly smaller. The smallest "dots" are located near the blast impact.

What makes the "Kirby dots" work is not the dots themselves, but the NEGATIVE SPACE around the dots. Notice how the negative space between the dots should look like lightning or energy. Well, that's the effect that is desired, and it's the entire point of adding in all those "dots". The "dots" make the "crackle" of energy.

One thing to remember when doing the "Kirby crackle" is that you want the effect to look somewhat random and natural--certainly not mechanical--so throw in the occasional large "dot" cluster near the blast radius and have several dots overlapping here and there from time to time.

I hope this sheads some light on how to approach the "Kirby crackle."

Loston
http://www.lostonwallace.com

Robin Riggs

07-25-2002, 08:27 AM

Thanks for posting this, Loston. I'm constantly amazed at how many professional pencillers seem to have no idea how to do this effect properly. From studying Kirby's 60's work it's evident that this technique evolved out of the way he drew explosions by rendering the billowing smoke behind rather than the flash itself. As he did more and more "cosmic" stuff it evolved into the crackle around energy. Unfortunately there seem to be a lot of artists who can't grasp the concept of defining a positive shape by rendering the negative and so as they copy the surface rendering on figures without understanding the underlying anatomy they copy the "Kirby dots" without understanding what they are meant to define. It's reached a point where I cringe when I see someone just draw a few black dots floating around something and think this is somehow a shorthand for energy.

Bruce Lee

07-25-2002, 09:03 AM

Robin,

You are right about the evolution of the "Kirby crackle", Robin. I'm always amazed by how Kirby's work influenced and altered comics as a medium. It's incredible to me that one guy could do so much for an industry.

Yeah, I unfortunately see a lot of the "new guys" who don't seem to fully understand the "Kirby dots". I recall several of my instructors at the Kubert School commenting about how many modern artists simply didn't grasp many of comics basic concepts, but instead, were only rapped up in surface elements. It's my hope that PJers won't fall into these kinds of traps, and a board like this one is perfect for countering such things.

Loston
http://www.lostonwallace.com

Inkthinker

07-25-2002, 01:01 PM

I remember the crackle... I love that effect :D

Grasping negative space is one of those skills that too many artists bypass, out of what I can only assume is laziness... though why anyone would hesitate to add another technique to their repetoire is beyond me.

TheFightingFoetus

07-25-2002, 05:26 PM

Kirby had lots of great shorthand squiggles. I really like his water effects.

kuje

07-25-2002, 10:27 PM

Thanks for posting that, Loston. I, honestly, had no idea how to use that effect, and I never even tried. I only remember seeing it in a few comics. Now I'm trying it out a bit in my sketchbook, hoping it'll help make some of my stuff more dynamic. Thanks again!:D

Tony Moore

07-26-2002, 03:23 AM

i think the most overlooked aspect of the kirby bubbles is indeed that those little clusters are most often used to define the negative space around energy of some sort. when employed correctly, i think it's one of the most interesting and powerful shorthand conventions that the comics medium has developed. Use it wisely, or otherwise it makes no sense and just looks like one of those superficial tricks that comic artists pull out when they don't know what else to do.

-T

Steampunk

08-09-2002, 01:22 PM

ok, i just saw this dave johnson cover and was reminded of this topic...

http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0208/09/mc.jpg

the idea of the dots being negative space around energy makes sense to me...it seems right, and i totally get it when it's in black and white, but what happens when colour is added? they way that johnson (i assume he coloured it too?) did the energy around this sword looks like the dots themselves are the energy...

so despite johnson's godliness (at least on these boards ;) ), does he not understand the crackle? or am i just confused?

Robin Riggs

08-09-2002, 01:52 PM

SenorSwanky

08-09-2002, 02:46 PM

Yeah, he's a brilliant artist but that's terrible.

Inkthinker

09-06-2002, 09:23 AM

A bump, since this has become relevant to a thread in the Sequentials section.

Black Ryu

01-01-2005, 05:05 PM

Hey Bruce, do you still have the tutorial jpeg? The website is down.

Bruce Lee

01-02-2005, 07:15 AM

Hey Bruce, do you still have the tutorial jpeg? The website is down.

I don't know if I still have that original image, Black Ryu. I do have the image from a later kirby dot tutorial though, and I've added a link to that one here, and will repost it in a new thread on this board:

http://www.penciljack.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42222&highlight=kirby+crackle]

Loston
http://www.lostonwallace.com

Akira X

01-09-2005, 04:31 PM

No I'm afraid he really doesn't get it at all. That's one of the worst uses I've ever seen. The yellow outline he's given the dots effectively turns them into a two dimensional object attatched to the side of the sword.

I think you've misinterpreted his intentions. Its obvious he isn't trying to create the same effect as Kirby Crackle. The black dots aren't a negative shape here, and are themselves emitting from the sword. Its a pretty common thing in a lot of Japanese cartoon, comics, and video games that any form of "dark" or "darkness" energy or magic is represented by unnatural purple or black clouds of Kirby Crackle-like bubbles where the bubbles are a positive shape. Common enough that is, that I've seen it enough times to recognize what Johnson was trying to accomplish.

Bruce Lee

01-09-2005, 09:13 PM

I think you've misinterpreted his intentions. Its obvious he isn't trying to create the same effect as Kirby Crackle. The black dots aren't a negative shape here, and are themselves emitting from the sword. Its a pretty common thing in a lot of Japanese cartoon, comics, and video games that any form of "dark" or "darkness" energy or magic is represented by unnatural purple or black clouds of Kirby Crackle-like bubbles where the bubbles are a positive shape. Common enough that is, that I've seen it enough times to recognize what Johnson was trying to accomplish.

The artist's original intent is something only he can shed light upon. We're all just guessing here, though my guess is that he was trying to do a Kirby-dot sort of effect. Bastardizations of this effect have been used in comicdom many times over the years by rookies and seasoned vets alike. Things become more and more stylized when reinterpretted (and misinterpretted) over and over again. Sometimes, things can get diluted when altered from the source. Artists in the fields of video games, anime, etc, have surely been influenced by Kirby's work (even if they are not aware of it), or have seen offshoots via other artists who have been influenced by Kirby, but make no mistake: this effect derived this from Jack Kirby's krackle effect, Akira. I'm almost certain of this. Many artists have chosen to take what they wanted out of it, or have simply misinterpretted things, or have learned it without fully understanding it, but that's undoubtedly the deal. If you know of anyone (Japanese artist or not) who has used this crackle energy effect prior to Kirby's Marvel stuff though, I'm sure the guys at TwoMorrows would love to hear about it! Don't forget that the Japanese artists were inspired greatly by American comics and artists. That's much of the origin of manga and anime. Things may have been lost in the translation here and there though. Anyway, only Johnson knows his original intent for certain, but if he was doing the Kirby-effect, I think he missed the boat.

Loston
http://www.lostonwallace.com

Robin Riggs

01-12-2005, 06:44 AM

I think you've misinterpreted his intentions.

I think you're wrong here, Nate. Dave's an excellent artist (and I'm delighted by the mighty fine covers he's doing on on Bloodhound) but I think what he did here was rendering an effect that has been intrinsic to the rendition of that sword since Michael Golden first drew it back in the seventies so it becomes little more than a flat design element. He's by no means the first to flatten it that way but it's really emphasized both because it's a painting and by the yellow outline. Take a look at Golden's cover for #12 of the original series from 1979 where the effect is clearly meant to be a holding shape for the energy glowing around the sword. I think it's been refined by so many artists over the years that it's just lost it's original meaning.

http://tinyurl.com/6atcg

amadarwin

01-12-2005, 02:22 PM

Not to beat a dying horse, but in Loston's example, he shows how the Kirby Krackle is done for a energy blast effect.

I'm curious Loston, how do you do the Kirby Krackle on a object filled with energy such as that sword in Johnson's pic? Everything I've tried really distracts my eye from the composition and the rest of the pic...

and Lastly, I think Jim Lee and Scott Williams had a pretty good bastardization of the Kirby Krackle going back in his heyday, but I'll have to go look for it...

NickGuy

01-14-2005, 09:28 AM

its amazing how Kirby did so much weird and crazy stuff that was so beyond his time. i couldnt even try to imitate some of the effects he put in his work.

samjw

07-13-2005, 03:12 PM

An attempted use of the Kirby crackle...

Not particularly good, but interesting. The whole issue is a tribute/spoof to Kirby and golden age comics. It's worth a read, I think.

Bruce Lee

07-14-2005, 09:01 AM

Woah! This thread is STILL going!? :eek: lol.

Loston

amadarwin

07-14-2005, 09:39 AM

kinda sorta. Besides, you never answered my question Loston - so get answerin! ;)

-the Burger King hath spoken

Bruce Lee

07-16-2005, 12:32 AM

I'm curious Loston, how do you do the Kirby Krackle on a object filled with energy such as that sword in Johnson's pic? Everything I've tried really distracts my eye from the composition and the rest of the pic...

Well, let me start off by saying that I don't know as to whether Jack Kirby ever used the Kirby Krackle in this manner as an aura or glow-effect around an object (such as a sword, etc). I've seen the krackle-effect used this way primarily by other artists like Perez, Adams, etc. Kirby would have probably been more inclined to use radiating outlines or zap lines than use the krackle this way, I'd wager (If anyone knows differently, I'd love to see a posted image where Kirby does the effect this way!).

Looking at the Johnson cover, the first thing I notice is that he isn't really pulling the krackle effect off very well, because he hasn't left enough negative space between the dots, and his dots do seem to be rather uniform, and lacking the random element that gave Jack Kirby's Krackle its unique..well, ENERGY!

Personally, I probably would have gone for much smaller dots around the sword, and probably would have strived for a more radiating, pulsating, energy shape around the weapon's blade. That seems a far cooler way to go about it. Johnson's effect sort of gives the impression of a chainsaw blade to me. heh. I might have contemplated placing the dots WITHIN the blade, allowing the blade to appear to be composed of crackling energy, instead of being simply surrounded by it. Yeah--that might be what Kirby would have done to, come to think of it.

If I had more time, I might experiment via Photoshop, but I don't at the moment. Sorry. :(

Loston

Goff

07-17-2005, 05:23 AM

Question for Loston or anyone for that matter.

Your example is excellent but I'm curious about a couple of things.

I'm assuming in your example that you saying the kirby dots are essentially the same color as the background (black) Thus it's really the white that is being rendered as the energy and that makes perfect sense. But then my question is basically what if you didn't want your entire panels background to be black does this render the kirby dots pointless?

As an example to what I'm trying to ask. In your example IF the energy was not radiating around or out all directions but instead was only being shown coming from your initial one direction would the whole background still need to be black to convey the effect? Again in other words if there was only one "beam of energy" hitting the character or coming out of the character instead of it coming out in different directions can you use the same effect?

That's a complicated and over worded question but hopefully you get my meaning.

Eric

F!NCH

07-17-2005, 07:09 AM

Well, boss man, I reckon the use of the solid black dots comes down to two things:

- it provides high contrast to allow the energy/positive area to seem that much brighter;

- a lot of the technique's use came from Kirby's cosmic stories, so the black negative area was most likely slivers of the space background.

From examples I've seen, it doesn't work so well with a regular background showing through in the "dotted" areas.

F!NCH

07-17-2005, 11:56 AM

This article (http://www.twomorrows.com/kirby/articles/33krackle.html) was pretty informative.

Bruce Lee

07-17-2005, 06:41 PM

But then my question is basically what if you didn't want your entire panels background to be black does this render the kirby dots pointless?

Eric,

I'm not sure I completely followed what you were asking, but here goes:

Well, one has to make a decision when to and when NOT to use the Kirby Krackle effect. Jack Kirby didn't always use it for everything. He usually used it for energy effects, most often regarding cosmic energy (but sometimes for fire effects too). Sometimes the effect just isn't going to be appropriate. It does work best, IMO, when the background is encompassed with the dots, but I've seen it work well within the confines of a cloud or blast shape as well. It's all in the execution.

As an example to what I'm trying to ask. In your example IF the energy was not radiating around or out all directions but instead was only being shown coming from your initial one direction would the whole background still need to be black to convey the effect? Again in other words if there was only one "beam of energy" hitting the character or coming out of the character instead of it coming out in different directions can you use the same effect?

It could be used in much the way I used it on the energy beam in step # 3 of my tutorial, with perhaps a few more free floating dots to give the cloud-like outlining of the beam a little more energy. That might work fine with an energy beam or even with a forcefield type situation.

Here's a couple of quick "down-n-dirty" marker sketches that might shed some lights on how one might go about using the effect without filling the entire background with Kirby dots. This method isn't really the Kirby method exactly, but rather the evolution of the effect by other creative comic artists:

I hope that was helpful.

Loston
http://www.lostonwallace.com

dbclemons

07-18-2005, 06:58 AM

I've used the Painter program to make these. It's pretty simple to adjust the random spacing and just draw them down. Love the look. Mignola does nice crackle.

CWmax

12-16-2005, 10:00 AM

Heh- I was reading about Jack Kirby on Wikipedia and noticed that this tread is linked on teh Wikipedia page....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirby_dots

Pretty Cool!

Inkthinker

12-18-2005, 04:23 PM

Wow... that's very cool. Decent example of how Kirby used the Krackle to delineate deep space in that cover, too.

Justice41

12-25-2005, 10:27 PM

Bruce Lee

12-25-2005, 10:54 PM

Also the black dots don't have to be black. they could be the same color as the background color which would really set of the white areas.
Isn't anyone learning anything from the old masters or are they just old guys not to be looked at for inspiration or guidance?

I think I've learned more from the old masters than from anyone. Kirby, Buscema, Wood--the work of those guys teach volumes.

I'm very flattered that this thread has made it to the Wikapedia, btw. That's cool.

Loston

Justice41

12-25-2005, 11:17 PM

Ever seen any of Kirby's paintings where he used the crackle effect but in full acrylic and watercolors colors? When I was kid I saw a book of Kirby art that had all kinds of stuff not comics related. I wish I could remember the books name and publisher. Ever put your name in google or ask google a question related to topics here?
Anyone here ever use google earth/ If so it has a very cool feature built in that renders in 3-d buildings. If you go to new york and eable buildings it draws the buildings out in 3-d. If you pay for the pro version it also has a capability to capture your views as movies. The news people use this feature when doing that map flyover thingy.
With all the love for Mignola on this and other sites you'd think more people would understand the coolness of using negative space to illustrate scenes with.

Bruce Lee

12-26-2005, 12:55 AM

Ever put your name in google or ask google a question related to topics here?

Yeah--holy crap!

Loston

Justice41

12-26-2005, 06:27 PM

And people are worried about the government spying on them. HA!. We tell everyone everything about ourselves just by going on line and buying stuff.

lunyboy

04-14-2006, 11:33 AM

I just recreated the dots in Illustrator... wow, once you have the outlines its very easy and QUICK.

e_t_i

04-16-2006, 05:23 PM

I know Kirby worked on the first issues of Challengers Of The Unknown, but do you think this explosion (http://comics.org/coverview.lasso?id=16370&zoom=4), this Multi Man (http://comics.org/coverview.lasso?id=16756&zoom=4), or maybe this Volcano Man (http://comics.org/coverview.lasso?id=17077&zoom=4) (all drawn by Bob Brown) could be considered precursors of Kirby Dots?

04-16-2006, 06:26 PM

I can see it in all of those except the molten man, he just looks like... a molten man. that or a burned piece of corn.

e_t_i

04-16-2006, 07:26 PM

Or a rip-off of The Thing.

e_t_i

03-09-2007, 12:30 PM

I found a few clear uses of Kirby dots in FF#37, page 2, frame 4 (contrary to the twomorrows article (http://www.twomorrows.com/kirby/articles/33krackle.html) which says it wasn't anywhere to be found in that issue), and even earlier in FF Annual #2 (1964), page 5, frame 1 (and possibly on page 4, frame 2). Will post images later.

e_t_i

03-10-2007, 10:40 AM

From FF#37 (April 1965), page 2, frame 4, pencils: Jack Kirby, inks: Chic Stone.
[/URL]

From FF Annual #2 (1964), page 5, frame 1, pencils: Jack Kirby, inks: Chic Stone.
(http://imageshack.us)

And on the previous page, this might not qualify as Kirby Dots but it gives a taste of things to come.
From FF Annual #2 (1964), page 4, frame 2, pencils: Jack Kirby, inks: Chic Stone.
[URL=http://imageshack.us]

Bruce Lee

03-12-2007, 04:10 AM

My god! This thread is ANCIENT! lol. I think it's pretty difficult to say just when the Kirby dots first appeared, because I've seen onion skins of some of Kirby's early FF pencils and noticed that inkers like Dick Ayers was altering things in the inks (including how Ben's rocks looked). It makes me wonder if the Kirby dots might have been pencilled in the early issues of FF or not. Until there's better evidence, one can only speculate. There's some school of thought that the dots proper were a bi-product of Jack and Joe Sinnott's pencil and ink colaboration, but I'm somewhat skeptical about that. Again, until more pencil evidence comes to the surface...

Loston

Jonesy3110

03-22-2007, 05:22 AM

what an awesome effect thanks for this great tutorial :D xxx

Bruce Lee

03-22-2007, 08:13 PM

what an awesome effect thanks for this great tutorial :D xxx

You're welcome. It's cool to know that the art of Jack Kirby is still lighting a pathway for artists even today. :)

Loston

bindlestitch

03-23-2007, 01:56 PM

I want to say thanks too Loston. Thanks for sharing your passion and experience with all of us here. It's helped me a lot and I haven't let you know about it. So , anyway, thanks man.
*end uncomfortable showing of feelings*

Bruce Lee

03-24-2007, 08:40 AM

Jonesy3110

05-03-2007, 07:20 AM

I stumbled across this

http://www.illcraft.blogspot.com/

and was reminded of this thread.

Bruce Lee

05-03-2007, 03:36 PM

Interesting, Jonesy.

Loston

e_t_i

11-25-2008, 07:14 PM

You all know I love Kirby, but I now think Kirby dots started a bit earlier when EC and Atlas comics guys like Wliliamson and Torres, would draw a space vortex.

From: Journey Into Unknown Worlds #4 ~ April/1955 - Atlas. Artist: Angelo Torres

Of course Kirby took it a lot further.

Tony Moore

11-25-2008, 07:28 PM

i made a photoshop brush kind of similar to that, which was basically a plain circle, with a pinch of roundness and angle jitter and a lot of scatter and size jitter. really great for tossing in some crackle for a digital breakdown.

this illustrator set looks a lot more developed than mine, though.

And yes, e_t_i, the EC guys use a similar technique fairly often. Wally Wood used large irregular blobs to create some wonderful smokey nebulae in some amazing space scenes for their Sci Fi books.

to bring that back around, i recommend checking out Sky Masters, which was pencilled by Kirby and inked by Wood.

-T

Bruce Lee

12-01-2008, 03:05 PM