HEAVY WEIGHT CHAMPIONSHIP - NYP vs. JUGGERTHA - THANOS

[NewYorkPicasso]

The Champ...Juggertha
http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/flavaricanprince/Drawing-Thanos.jpg
The Challenger....NYP
http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee136/flavaricanprince/death2.jpg

[BPS Morganza]

Nyp for the win! Your work gets better every round, I enjoy watching your progress!

[dreno360]

NYP's piece is very solid. Very nice anatomy on the characters, good faces, hands, and feet... excellent piece for sure.

[Popninja]

NYP's is better drawn, but very subdued. I was really hoping that with a HEAVYWEIGHT championship match, we would see some KILLER pieces from both of you.

[Wassy]

I'm.... torn. Juggertha has sort of a ho-hum scene. The colors are nice, but a lot of it is special brushes. NYP did a more dynamic scene but... it's strange. It's like a pacing panel or something, the moment in between big moments.

I dunno...

[Keith]

NYP's is better drawn, but very subdued. I was really hoping that with a HEAVYWEIGHT championship match, we would see some KILLER pieces from both of you.

I think the detail of it is killer, the side panel, the floor and pipes around it, the surroundings and the figures have a feeling of "weight" to it and brings a lot of impact to the scene. I think the weakest part of it is maybe the female figure's perspective, it seems a tiny bit off, but otherwise I think it's a worthy piece, it just needs to be a tiny bit bigger resolution imo

Juggertha's piece needed something else going on in the background I feel like, something a bit more than just brush strokes and the fractal. The colors seems a little dull and muddy as well compared to his other stuff.

[Juggertha]

Sorry to disappoint. This piece frustrated me at every stage pretty much.

Congrats to the new champ, NYP!

[Aabh]

Went with Juggs. I love NYP's piece, but Juggertha's has so much OOMPH. I love the color and the power of the piece. I vote before I read the others comments so I don't get distracted, and I agree with a lot of the comments... NYP's piece is awesome... But Juggs is just power.

[paintingfire]

I went with Juggertha- NYP, your piece is very well done, and I can see that a lot of work went into it, but it just didn't hold a lot of interest for me- I think, like someone said above, it is like one of those in between panels. Juggertha's piece really caught my attention and held it.

[scmarooney]

I really, really like Thanos' right hand in Ed's illustration, and the infinity gems look really cool. The rest of it I don't like quite as much! NYP's features a great angle, and one that is hard to pull off so convincingly, but I do agree with the feeling that it is a sort of "in-between-the-action" panel on a comic page. Went with Erik this time out.

[spidey976]

Voted Juggs on this one ... it just had more of a punch for me. NYP your piece is awesome, but given the subject matter I was expecting you to kick it up a notch and show one HELL of a battle.

[Fallenangel]

NYP's is better drawn, but very subdued. I was really hoping that with a HEAVYWEIGHT championship match, we would see some KILLER pieces from both of you.

I agree with every word here.

In the end voted for NYP.

Fallen.

[Walril]

NYP, the only thing thats bothering me (like I can really talk) is that death doesn't seem in the same plane as the other figures. Like the perspective is off. The scene is almost a top down and she is straight on.

I feel like i dont deserve to vote for this because its like a plumber without IT experience telling two IT guys are doing it wrong.

[ghostcat]

I also agree with Pop. NYP has the better piece, but it's boring.

[CrazyDiamond]

I voted for Jugga mainly because I have seen NYP do better. Whenever I see that NYP is competing I can't wait to click inside and see what has been done. I feel this one was not up to his usual standard.

[dfbovey]

I don't really understand that line of thinking in voting. This isn't Juggertha's best piece either. And they aren't completing against themselves, there's two pieces of art in this thread going head to head. You should be voting on these pieces. One or the other based on what's shown.

While I agree that it's not the most exiting, it looks like it could be a professional panel out of a comic. It's at a difficult angle, shows understanding of perspective. And that's why it ended up getting my vote.

[Keith]

I don't really understand that line of thinking in voting. This isn't Juggertha's best piece either. And they aren't completing against themselves, there's two pieces of art in this thread going head to head. You should be voting on these pieces. One or the other based on what's shown.


I mean, the main thing I'm reading here is NYP's piece isn't exciting or it's boring, while it's not wild in any way, it's well drawn overall.

But what's so exciting about a head shot with a hand next to it? Dunno, I'm truly stumped here.

[Fallenangel]

I mean, the main thing I'm reading here is NYP's piece isn't exciting or it's boring, while it's not wild in any way, it's well drawn overall.

But what's so exciting about a head shot with a hand next to it? Dunno, I'm truly stumped here.

I think what they mean by "exciting" is the original impact of the picture, Juggs piece is very well colored and at first glance stands out more compared to NYP's pic. That is why people tend vote for it.

[CrazyDiamond]

I don't really understand that line of thinking in voting. This isn't Juggertha's best piece either. And they aren't completing against themselves, there's two pieces of art in this thread going head to head. You should be voting on these pieces. One or the other based on what's shown.



Isn't it wonderful that we all get to have our own opinion and our own vote and get to use each as we want? :D Even though you can tell me how you think that I should think and vote you do not have the power to change it. Nor should you. :)

[dfbovey]

Isn't it wonderful that we all get to have our own opinion and our own vote and get to use each as we want? :D Even though you can tell me how you think that I should think and vote you do not have the power to change it. Nor should you. :)

Sure, as long as you'd like to continue to make no sense by voting for the reasons that you do.

I could change it if I wanted to. I could simply edit the poll. But that would be just as wrong as your mentality of not actually voting based on the pieces presented as they compare to each other, which is the entire point of the voting poll.

[Juggertha]

Come on ppl, chill with the drama.

I'll be the first to admit that this wasn't my best piece. I got frustrated at nearly every stage of it, AND i did two Cons this month.

I'll let NYP speak for himself, but I have a feeling that we both can do much better.


Vote how ya want though, and share why ya voted. But in the end, opinions are like... ;)

[Furmanjon]

So if I do a piece better than the one I did for my last match any given month, I should win? Regardless of what my opponent does?

[dfbovey]

Vote how you want, but at least have the basis of the vote be comparing one piece to the other. Seems like a straight forward concept that anyone should get.

[BPS Morganza]

This is not an art school, most people here are amateurs including myself, some people do not have an eye for technical skill.

[Popninja]

...some people do not have an eye for technical skill.

Ain't that the truth.

[spidey976]

This is not an art school, most people here are amateurs including myself, some people do not have an eye for technical skill.

Oh please don't take my vote for Juggs as me not acknowledging your skills. The thing is an amazing amount of work, effort, and skill can go into an establishing shot or a simple shot of a street. However, that doesnt't necessarily make those shots exciting and make ME want to vote for them in a BATTLE situation like a HeavyWeight Championship match. Throw in the fact that there are problems with both pieces (as said before the perspective on Lady Death looks off in your piece), and I decided to vote for the piece that had the most punch, and for me personally that was Juggs. NYP f you had done a battle scene like I know you can this may have been a far more lopsided battle.

[Wassy]

^ Oops tencharacters

[Dann]

Oh please don't take my vote for Juggs as me not acknowledging your skills. The thing is an amazing amount of work, effort, and skill can go into an establishing shot or a simple shot of a street. However, that doesnt't necessarily make those shots exciting and make ME want to vote for them in a BATTLE situation like a HeavyWeight Championship match. Throw in the fact that there are problems with both pieces (as said before the perspective on Lady Death looks off in your piece), and I decided to vote for the piece that had the most punch, and for me personally that was Juggs. NYP f you had done a battle scene like I know you can this may have been a far more lopsided battle.


Ahhhhahahahahaha....

Spidey %#@ed up!!

[spidey976]

Ahhhhahahahahaha....

Spidey %#@ed up!!

How so??? Other then some poor grammar ...lol.

[CrazyDiamond]

Vote how you want.

I will. Just as everyone should have the right to do. That is the whole point of having a vote. :)

[Juggertha]

How so??? Other then some poor grammar ...lol.

I'm not seeing it either.

I see a lot of backhanded insults going on in this thread, and I feel that Spidey took a stand.

[Wassy]

He was attributing something Morg said to NYP.

[dfbovey]

I will. Just as everyone should have the right to do. That is the whole point of having a vote. :)

The whole point in having a vote is to choose between two pieces based on what's shown.

If you had just said you voted for Juggertha because you liked his piece better, I wouldn't have thunk twice about it. The problem is, your logic and reasoning goes against the whole purpose of these one on one competitions. These matches aren't based on what's been done in the past. It's one piece against the other. Past pieces shouldn't be a part of the thought process. If that is part of your criteria. Then, you don't get it.

[dfbovey]

He was attributing something Morg said to NYP.

Noticed that as well.

[Furmanjon]

The whole point in having a vote is to choose between two pieces based on what's shown.

If you had just said you voted for Juggertha because you liked his piece better, I wouldn't have thunk twice about it. The problem is, your logic and reasoning goes against the whole purpose of these one on one competitions. These matches aren't based on what's been done in the past. It's one piece against the other. Past pieces shouldn't be a part of the thought process. If that is part of your criteria. Then, you don't get it.

This. What's described here is what kept me away for a while, to be honest.

[Juggertha]

He was attributing something Morg said to NYP.

That's not how I read it at all.

Spidey just failed to hit return and separate the paragraphs for that last sentence.

[Wassy]

I would agree with that, except for a couple points:


Oh please don't take my vote for Juggs as me not acknowledging your skills. The thing is an amazing amount of work, effort, and skill can go into an establishing shot or a simple shot of a street. However, that doesnt't necessarily make those shots exciting and make ME want to vote for them in a BATTLE situation like a HeavyWeight Championship match. Throw in the fact that there are problems with both pieces (as said before the perspective on Lady Death looks off in your piece), and I decided to vote for the piece that had the most punch, and for me personally that was Juggs. NYP f you had done a battle scene like I know you can this may have been a far more lopsided battle.

Really, the first sentence. He was replying to Morg's quote, but was directing the comments as if NYP had said them.

[BPS Morganza]

Oh please don't take my vote for Juggs as me not acknowledging your skills. The thing is an amazing amount of work, effort, and skill can go into an establishing shot or a simple shot of a street. However, that doesnt't necessarily make those shots exciting and make ME want to vote for them in a BATTLE situation like a HeavyWeight Championship match. Throw in the fact that there are problems with both pieces (as said before the perspective on Lady Death looks off in your piece), and I decided to vote for the piece that had the most punch, and for me personally that was Juggs. NYP f you had done a battle scene like I know you can this may have been a far more lopsided battle.

You stated reasons for not voting for someone, but then you turn it around and say you voted for the art with the most "punch", this is exactly what I was talking about. NYP would have to have drawn a battle scene to compete with Juggertha's static Thanos Bust according to you.

Can you explain why you think Juggertha's work is superior to NYP's with the same descriptive reasons you gave for not voting for a piece?

You are trying to make your voting reasons look technical when it is not, it's just your opinion when you voted for the most "punch". And there's nothing wrong voting with your own opinion, You can try to justify it with technical reasons by tearing apart the opposing piece but you should really Justify your vote if you are going to use technical critiques.

I don't know if I'm explaining myself clearly but I hope you get what I'm saying.

[Juggertha]

Ah, I see that now. I honestly thoughts he was directing at at someone other than NYP... and that he simply didn't separate the paragraphs

[NewYorkPicasso]

My two cents....if you CAN draw better than me, and there are a few of you here that can, like Bovey, Loston, Hadesillustrations, Morganza, Keith, Plog, Teratophile, Beastie, and a few others out there, i'll respect whatever crits you have and listen and try to improve based on those comments.......but if you CAN'T draw better than me.....just shut the **** up......and don't ever vote for me.

THANKS!!!!

[spidey976]

You stated reasons for not voting for someone, but then you turn it around and say you voted for the art with the most "punch", this is exactly what I was talking about. NYP would have to have drawn a battle scene to compete with Juggertha's static Thanos Bust according to you.

Can you explain why you think Juggertha's work is superior to NYP's with the same descriptive reasons you gave for not voting for a piece?

You are trying to make your voting reasons look technical when it is not, it's just your opinion when you voted for the most "punch". And there's nothing wrong voting with your own opinion, You can try to justify it with technical reasons by tearing apart the opposing piece but you should really Justify your vote if you are going to use technical critiques.

I don't know if I'm explaining myself clearly but I hope you get what I'm saying.

Juggertha harnessed the basics of the character of Thanos "The Mad Titan" for me. He looks batsh@t crazy, and like the world is about to burn. That combined with an amazing coloring job won me over. There are issues to be sure, hell I want to see Thanos taring it up, but the essence odd the character is there where as I don't see that in NYP piece. So yes the characterization is part of it for me, and yeah that is MY Oppinions I wasn't trying to hide it behind anything, but there is a more I depth description. I am also sorry about the grammar mistake I meant to say "his skill" so I did mess up.

[Popninja]

My two cents....if you CAN draw better than me, and there are a few of you here that can, like Bovey, Loston, Hadesillustrations, Morganza, Keith, Plog, Teratophile, Beastie, and a few others out there, i'll respect whatever crits you have and listen and try to improve based on those comments.......but if you CAN'T draw better than me.....just shut the **** up......and don't ever vote for me.

THANKS!!!!

Wow...

Seriously?

Wow...

[spidey976]

My two cents....if you CAN draw better than me, and there are a few of you here that can, like Bovey, Loston, Hadesillustrations, Morganza, Keith, Plog, Teratophile, Beastie, and a few others out there, i'll respect whatever crits you have and listen and try to improve based on those comments.......but if you CAN'T draw better than me.....just shut the **** up......and don't ever vote for me.

THANKS!!!!

Honestly, THAT is your attitude?? If you don't think someone can draw better than you their critiques mean NOTHING, and they should just sit back and shut the FCUK UP!!! Dude I am sorry, but that is an argument for a god d&$n rookie to make. Shit is off in your pic, and I and others can see that. Does it mean we can do better, not necessarily, but that doesn't make it any less off. Dude you are good, great even, but even great artists take C&C all the time with WAY more class than this.

[NewYorkPicasso]

Wow...

Seriously?

Wow...

I get real angry when someone says I said something that I did not. Got arrested for that dumb shit once and it really pisses me off when someone attributes something to me that I never said or did. If I hurt anyone feelings, I'm sorry, with sugar on top.

[spidey976]

I get real angry when someone says I said something that I did not. Got arrested for that dumb shit once and it really pisses me off when someone attributes something to me that I never said or did. If I hurt anyone feelings, I'm sorry, with sugar on top.

Dude it was a grammar mistake, and I am sorry I made it, but I'd this is your actual attitude you don't know what this site is all abou.

[Juggertha]

Must be the summer heat.

[BPS Morganza]

I get real angry when someone says I said something that I did not. Got locked up for that dumb shit once and it really pisses me off when someone attributes something to me that I never said. If I hurt anyone feelings, I'm sorry, with sugar on top.

You need to get smacked in the mouth! Potty MOUTH!! It's not worth losing your shit over peoples opinions, focus on your art, because that speaks volumes. Nuff Said!

[Furmanjon]

gettin' all verklempt in here

[Juggertha]

gettin' all verklempt in here

After looking that up, I'm still confused. lol

[Furmanjon]

haha. Yiddish. Usually means getting choked up with tears, but more broadly, really overcome with emotion. Made popular by SNL in the 90s...Coffee Talk.

[NewYorkPicasso]

Morg, for six years I have taken critiques, comments, even some slights, with no problems, I welcome that, it's what has made me improve immensely in a short span and quicker than average cause with my career and other commitments I would only draw once a week for the most part. I make it my business to always keep my cool and make sure when I say something I get my facts right cause I have experienced first hand what can happen when someone says you did something you did not. That just puts pee in my cheerios.

[Wassy]

Must be the summer heat.

I know I'm hot *wink wink*

[spidey976]

Morg, for six years I have taken critiques, comments, even some slights, with no problems, I welcome that, it's what has made me improve immensely in a short span and quicker than average cause with my career and other commitments I would only draw once a week for the most part. I make it my business to always keep my cool and make sure when I say something I get my facts right cause I have experienced first hand what can happen when someone says you did something you did not. That just puts pee in my cheerios.

BS ... If you had said hey I didn't say that get your sh!t straight I would agree, but you didn't say that. You flat out said " if you can't draw better than me SHUT THE F&!k UP"! Is this or isn't this your opinion?? I tend to think it has to be because you have never
Seen you say anything else. Now you seem to be dodging what you said.
Again, I am sorry about the mistake, but I also complented your skill. I have the courage to admit my opinions and faults. Do you?

[NewYorkPicasso]

I dont dodge anyone or anything and my comments were actually meant for you. Apology accepted, thanks for the compliment, and yes I have a ton of faults and that's why you have never seen me say anything else, when I'm good enough and know enough to make an intelligent analysis I will, but until then I won't go around saying someone said something they didn't.

[spidey976]

I dont dodge anyone or anything and my comments were actually meant for you. Apology accepted, thanks for the compliment, and yes I have a ton of faults and that's why you have never seen me say anything else, when I'm good enough and know enough to make an intelligent analysis I will, but until then I won't go around saying someone said something they didn't.

So now I am not good enough or smart enough to comment on your piece? That is what you are getting at here right? I can read between the lines dude. Dude I could give you a I depth blow by blow critique about why I think this piece is off, from perspective to characterization, but you are not worth it. So I will do what you ask and just ignore your stuff and not vote for you because god you aren't worth it when I can be helping those who appreciate it.

P.S. if you go back and read what I originally wrote it wasn't even all that bad, and had a simple slip of the tongue. You over reacted NYP, and just showed a crap load of ignorance.

[Juggertha]

Seriously, this thread is heading for a lock.

Go out, get something cool to drink, and everyone chilllllll......

http://www.bat-mania.co.uk/main/villains/images/otto_freeze.jpg

[NewYorkPicasso]

So now I am not good enough or smart enough to comment on your piece? That is what you are getting at here right? I can read between the lines dude. Dude I could give you a I depth blow by blow critique about why I think this piece is off, from perspective to characterization, but you are not worth it. So I will do what you ask and just ignore your stuff and not vote for you because god you aren't worth it when I can be helping those who appreciate it.

P.S. if you go back and read what I originally wrote it wasn't even all that bad, and had a simple slip of the tongue. You over reacted NYP, and just showed a crap load of ignorance.

Most Critics have one thing in Common....FAILURE...food critics are usually failed chefs, movie critics are usually failed actors, music critics are usually failed singers or musicians, etc, etc, etc. I have done pretty well in life and art without your critiques and I think I will continue to manage but I'm sure your wealth of knowledge will help someone out there. I sure don't need it.

[Teratophile]

Oh shit, sass!

[spidey976]

Most Critics have one thing in Common....FAILURE...food critics are usually failed chefs, movie critics are usually failed actors, music critics are usually failed singers or musicians, etc, etc, etc. I have done pretty well in life and art without your critiques and I think I will continue to manage but I'm sure your wealth of knowledge will help someone out there. I sure don't need it.

Wow... Just ... Wow. There aren't even words for how wrong what you just said is given the context of THIS site, and the people who are on it who give the best critiques.


Juggs I am so sorry for derailing this thread, I am out of it now though. I really am sorry though. You deserve better.

[CrazyDiamond]

Deleted message.

[battlereaper]

I went with NYP based on the execution of the work. While I think that a more active scene would have been better, the dynamic perspective, character grouping, anatomy and background win me over.

I do like the punch of Juggertha's piece, but it's not as impressive as I would expect from a fully rendered pinup of Thanos.

[ScorpioReport]

I enjoyed nyp's comp and rendering, juggs got my vote for the mood his pic gave...and it kind of reminded me of those old classic wizard magazine covers.

[basil81]

The perspective on NYP's is way too distorted because the vanishing points are placed too close together. While this could be used to great effect in certain cases, here it just seems awkward. Juggs' piece seems to favor photoshop effects over substance, as Thanos looks too much like a cardboard cutout against an un-interesting background.

My vote went to NYP for better anatomy and competent pencil rendering.

[NewYorkPicasso]

The perspective on NYP's is way too distorted because the vanishing points are placed too close together. While this could be used to great effect in certain cases, here it just seems awkward. Juggs' piece seems to favor photoshop effects over substance, as Thanos looks too much like a cardboard cutout against an un-interesting background.

My vote went to NYP for better anatomy and competent pencil rendering.

You are absolutely correct Basil and I respect your opinion. This was just a concept sketch that I rushed and just eyeballed the perspective and hoped for the best cause I played it too close to the deadline (as usual) and did not have time to redraw on a comic board and ink it as intended. And yeah it is a bit awkward but everybody drops an egg every now and then.

[basil81]

You are absolutely correct Basil and I respect your opinion. This was just a concept sketch that I rushed and just eyeballed the perspective and hoped for the best cause I played it too close to the deadline (as usual) and did not have time to redraw on a cimc board and ink it as intended. And yeah it is a bit awkward but everybody drops an egg every now and then.

We all do, NYP. Heck I drop eggs daily (...tmi?)

[Juggertha]

Congratulations to the new 5 time Heavyweight champ!

May his reign last only long enough for me to take it back!! ;)

[dfbovey]

One more and he's tied with me with 6 heavyweight championships.

[NewYorkPicasso]

David, I think Mr. Keith is going to clean my clock next month but I am going to do my very best to tie your illustrious record of 6 heavyweight titles.

[Solace]

Voted NYP. I don't have much to add, but I wanted to mention that the "wall of chicklets" style teeth in Juggs really don't work for me. It's a long standing pet peeve of mine because it ruins the illusion of the jaw, and is visually jarring in non cartoony characters.

[drawdan]

Congrats NY...I went with Juggs piece this month only because it felt more dramatic and imposing...very fitting of the character of Thanos. But your rendering is top shelf. The perspective is real strong but I agreeed with the comments on the page feeling like a moment 'in between' better moments. I know that your gonna bring it next month to get that 6th win, so I can't wait to see what you pull out.